My ocean blue 1999 996.1 C2

[wellsy]

Fantastic update. All credit to you and CG for persisting in your quest for your perfect setup. Will this eventually be a package upgrade offered by CG?

And lovely 997 by the way. You have quite the collection now :thumbs:

 

[tob_today]

Fantastic update. All credit to you and CG for persisting in your quest for your perfect setup. Will this eventually be a package upgrade offered by CG?

And lovely 997 by the way. You have quite the collection now :thumbs:

Thanks, I wanted to take the time to share my experience & journey as suspension-related topics come up many times in this forum. Hopefully some of it helps others with ideas for their own cars.

It was a mix of persistence from both Chris and myself. I'm not someone that gives up easily, and there's something about the 996 that gets to me. If I give up on this one, I'm giving up on 996's entirely. I didn't want to do that. Then I met Chris, someone who similarly didn't want to give up finding the perfect solution both for me, and other ideas he was already thinking about. So perhaps good timing too, as is often the case when two people meet & something new is produced.

I've lost count how many trips I've made up & down to Atherstone from London over the last year on this project. Probably around 7 return trips by either car or train, mostly on weekends. My wife thinks I'm mad!

Plus Chris & team invested very significant time on their side. All of us learning on the way. Plus I met lots of great people during this adventure, and there's always very interesting cars & people at CG. So it's also been fun.

Yes Chris is intending to sell a new product for the 996 market. Best to give them a call if you are curious for more details, timelines, etc or you just want to explore a similar set-up for your car. Just mention Toby's CG-prototype 996 C2. They all know this project

And yes, my collection of cars is interesting & I'm very lucky. It wasn't intended or planned, just sort of happened over time. I promised myself many years ago I would never buy a blue car again, and now I have three blue 911's! So you never know what will happen in future in our unpredictable world.

 

[911munKy]

Thanks for the update, I had 80k standard suspension on my 3.4 C2 then updated the worn components and fitted M030 (better but still harsh and sat too high) next I fitted lower Eibach springs with the M030 dampers (bit better still but too low at the rear so then fitted perch spacers to lift the rear).
It's improved slightly with each modification but is still on the harsh side (I know what you mean about the jarring over M25 concrete sections!) It's much more compliant and comfortable loaded up with 2 adults, full tank and a frunk full of shopping although it's mainly just me driving.
X74 Geometry, it would benefit from a bit more playing around but I don't want to spend more money or time on it at the moment, maybe next Summer.

 

[tob_today]

Ride height is one of the major considerations.

As there's some interest, I'll give bit more details on my specific requirements in case it helps anyone else.

I wanted as low as possible that would still allow me to comfortably tackle the numerous speed bumps that surround me. Unfortunately I don't live in open B-road territory. I live in London with good access to get out to those better roads, but first I have to deal with a very large number of mixed bumps, with varying aggressiveness. This is daily-duty territory. Dealing with these is #1 priority. The car came with M030 that had dropped over the years and scraping over bumps was not fun.

Away from the speed bumps I have some very poorly surfaced roads with speed limits ranging from 20-50 mph, before opening up into better A-roads. Then I have the horrible concrete sections of the M25 to deal with in both directions whenever I'm heading off somewhere outside London.

So now I have M030 height minus 3mm and Chris also trimmed 5mm off the plastic spat trims in front of both front tyres. Plus I have Michelin PS4's which give some extra sidewall. Combined I'm now just making it over the bumps and not scraping anymore.

I would love to go a bit lower, but I need to move house first & that's not on the cards. I can always adjust lower if / when that happens.

After getting the height right, I wanted as much compliance as possible. Again to suit the above driving roads. I actually said I want my 996 to ride like the M033 on my 993, which sits low on it's 18's and is a beautiful compliant ride. 'Magic carpet' is super subjective, but that's as close as I've had. It also has just enough movement at higher speeds / corners to suit my style. I'm not looking to be a track-god with totally flat cornering. However Chris explained the 996 and 993 are totally different cars, and there's more flex in the 993 body, so it's more of a challenge on the 996.

I also wanted a set-up that would perform well on fast A & B road driving and occasional track-days, plus comfortable on motorway driving. Basically I wanted everything!

Other options we considered and discounted with Chris on the many conversations over the last months were:

* standard 996 springs & dampers - these sit far too high for me, and perhaps too soft. I still want a sports ride, although I can't judge how they would have performed. Ride height alone ruled these out.

* KW or other coilovers - given what we wanted to achieve, Chris recommended Ohlins R&T as best option when we tried that route. As Ohlins didn't work for me, none of the others would have been better.

* TracTive ACE - Chris has this on their Boxster, and I did consider it, however it's serious £££ and I wanted to keep the analogue nature of my 996, and minimise electronics in the driving experience with this car.

We also considered all the regular spring / damper options they set up every day on customer's cars. And ruled all of these out.

Hence in the end we took a chance & went down the totally bespoke route. I totally trusted Chris and had nothing to lose. If I didn't like it he'd refit Ohlins or something else, so I could sell the car knowing it would be perfectly set up like that for the next owner.

So I handed over the keys, told him to do whatever he wanted to the car, drive it as hard as he wanted, as far as he wanted, and keep it as long as he wanted. Use for his own R&D and perhaps I also get what I wanted at the end. And I did

Anyway, hopefully some of you find this useful background. If you are interested in something similar now or reading this in future, I suggest you give Holly, Chris & team a call at Center Gravity and register your interest in the new 996 product he's creating.

Knowing there's demand will help bring this to market.

 

[sp1ke]

Great to hear about your suspension journey. You seem to have been a step ahead of me all year
Coincidentally your 993 was at Precision earlier in the year, when I was collecting my 996, & I recall seeing "SYX" parked outside CG, when I visited in August.

Mine had a complete suspension refresh in 2019 with Bilstein PSS10's at around X74 height. It was due to visit CG in 2020, but lockdowns resulted in this being deferred till this summer. It's finally been tweaked to provide more compliance & is much better suited for a/b roads & all the speed bumps around SW London.

 

[Kersidan]

Very interesting thread and great write up, thank you.

I've been toying with the idea of removing the standard (M030) suspension on my 996 C4S in favour of something more compliant and suitable to real life A+B roads in the UK. I might be giving CG a call at some point to ask their advice.

Mark

 

[tob_today]

Great to hear about your suspension journey. You seem to have been a step ahead of me all year
Coincidentally your 993 was at Precision earlier in the year, when I was collecting my 996, & I recall seeing "SYX" parked outside CG, when I visited in August.

Mine had a complete suspension refresh in 2019 with Bilstein PSS10's at around X74 height. It was due to visit CG in 2020, but lockdowns resulted in this being deferred till this summer. It's finally been tweaked to provide more compliance & is much better suited for a/b roads & all the speed bumps around SW London.

Ah small world - although at least one of my cars is always hanging around a specialist somewhere so always a good chance to spot one Yes, the speed bumps in SW London are very excessive!

Very interesting thread and great write up, thank you. I've been toying with the idea of removing the standard (M030) suspension on my 996 C4S in favour of something more compliant and suitable to real life A+B roads in the UK. I might be giving CG a call at some point to ask their advice.

Glad it helps Mark. Chris was telling me last weekend that he's been pushing their development C4S to it's limits, so he's on the way to having a solution. Good idea to give them a call, even if just to enquire and register interest. Helps Chris gauge market demand, which always helps getting new products out faster. :thumb:

 

[Daz850]

Lovely 996 you have there.
I have just bought the same colour combo C2 but totally standard.
After seeing yours I think I need the same wheels as you 8)

 

[Super_Ray]

Loving the blues brothers! Enjoyed reading that, keep up the good work and thanks for sharing!

Glad you enjoy them. I also enjoy keeping a record & going back reading from the start, otherwise I forget everything!

Wow! A great read. If you keep this up it'll be one of the finest 996s on the road. Can I ask what spec you requested from Royal for the wheel retrim? I have the 3 spoke and it's in great condition but would like a bit more of a premium feel to it. Yours looks great.

Sure, here's the order confirmation email from Royal: "Order: Porsche 996 sport - Original thickness, Black smooth printed leather, Black stitching – originally"

The leather is slightly lighter than the black rubber / plastic air bag centre but it's good enough and will probably darken with age. I did speak to some other Porsche retrim specialists before deciding, but that would have been a lot more money and they all have very long waiting lists (many months in some cases). They all pointed me to Royal which was a good sign. I'm very happy with it (and I'm quite picky in case you didn't already notice)

Sorry to jump on this post but thought it might be helpful for others using Royal Steering Wheels and weighing up options.

My order was "996 manual (3 spoke, Black) - full black alcantara 9040 + red centre stripe, red stitching"

HTH Ray

 

[tob_today]

Lovely 996 you have there.
I have just bought the same colour combo C2 but totally standard.
After seeing yours I think I need the same wheels as you 8)

Very nice! I really like the 18" 5 spoke Carrera BBS wheels on mine. As well as looking great they are super easy to clean & very light too. Double :thumbs:

 

[tob_today]

Sorry to jump on this post but thought it might be helpful for others using Royal Steering Wheels and weighing up options.

My order was "996 manual (3 spoke, Black) - full black alcantara 9040 + red centre stripe, red stitching"

HTH Ray

Agree, Royal are very good & cost-effective compared to many others retrimmers. They have many different options too, plus fast turnaround.

 

[sp1ke]

@Toby

After the refurb, is your steering wheel thicker than a standard one?

I'm looking to get my wheel & some interior leather bits refurb'd over the next year or so, but I'm keen to keep an OEM style thin rim.

 

[tob_today]

After the refurb, is your steering wheel thicker than a standard one?

I'm looking to get my wheel & some interior leather bits refurb'd over the next year or so, but I'm keen to keep an OEM style thin rim.

It's still relatively thin. I can't remember how it compares to the original wheel, but I do remember thinking "should I have gone thicker?". However I love it just as it came back. It's perfect for me.

 

[steve535]

Hi Tob_Today, I have really enjoyed following your thread - very interesting reading. I have a 99 C2 TipS in the same colour as yours and am really struck by the difference the amber lenses and side repeaters make to the look of your car. I'm definately interested in the conversion and wondered whether you replaced the full units (headlamps and rear light cluster) or just the lenses (if that can be done). Would you mind sharing where you sourced the replacements and what is involved, please.

 

[tob_today]

Hi Tob_Today, I have really enjoyed following your thread - very interesting reading. I have a 99 C2 TipS in the same colour as yours and am really struck by the difference the amber lenses and side repeaters make to the look of your car. I'm definately interested in the conversion and wondered whether you replaced the full units (headlamps and rear light cluster) or just the lenses (if that can be done). Would you mind sharing where you sourced the replacements and what is involved, please.

Hi Steve535 - glad you are able to take something from this thread. I basically cruised ebay for a few weeks gathering parts separately. Ideally it's best to get them all from a single seller so they match and hopefully all work together.

But I didn't get lucky finding single seller, so went down the individual route with the inevitable bad descriptions / returns on the way. I bought separate whole units: 2x front, 2x rear and 2x side indicator lenses. If going this way, look carefully at the photos to make sure they are not damaged / discoloured, and the fronts are 996 and not Boxster (if you care, think they work the same - it's just a different pattern inside the lenses).

They are very easy to swap out with existing clear units front & rear. Plenty of good YouTube videos. Although there's something not 100% with the electronics with mine so main beam doesn't work properly on one side. Precision say most likely due to the connections somewhere, so I'm taking the old ones in to them so they can test & rectify.

One note: some of the front units have different internal components. I haven't quite worked out why & how to easily identify without opening the back of the units and taking look, and potentially that's why mine aren't 100%.

Easiest is to compare yours with photos and make sure they are exact match except the amber. They also have 996x part numbers on the units with a marker showing manufacturing date if you want to get that detailed.

It's not cheap at around £200 per unit (x4 = £800) but you might get deal all together, and you can resell your clear lenses after.

Hope this helps.