Porsche 911 UK Enthusiasts Online Community Discussion Forum GB

Welcome to the @Porsche911UK website. Register a free account today to become a member! Sign up is quick and easy, then you can view, participate in topics and posts across the site that covers all things Porsche.

Already registered and looking to recovery your account, select 'login in' and then the 'forget your password' option.

Where to get hybrid turbos

ragpicker

Portimao
Joined
14 Apr 2013
Messages
4,062
So i am on the upgrade trail for my 996tt. It currently has standard k16 turbos.

I am wondering which route to go down. Its a tip so I think the magic number will be 600-650bhp as a street car.

I am thinking some k16/24 hybrids would be the best bet for this application.

Where would I source them and roughly how much are we talking? I've seen offers of exchanges on eBay for £1200?

I've phoned AET turbos and they would modify my own turbos with a 30lb/min k24 wheel for £600 +vat each. For some fancy actuators it is an extra £300+vat for the pair.

Anything wrong with the eBay ones? Anyone got any other alternatives or preferences??
 
I have billet wheel AMS k16s on mine, they spool as quick as stock but keep pulling! I am very pleased with how they perform, i'm on boost just after 2k and the torque is breath taking.
 
Modern machining capabilities means they can now manufacture the compressor wheel out of billet ally, so they can make any shape you like with no casting imperfections, lighter and with improved designs not limited to the casting process. The billet wheel is quicker spooling, flows more and more efficient.

Check out the gtx turbo series by Garrett, they are all billet wheel.
 
AMS sell their own variant, loads of others sell theirs. I think they are 5k dollars for the pair from ams, something like 10k for the kit, but there's always other bits you need.
 
Cheers for that e8!

I am properly confused looking around at turbos. I now understand that k16s with a billet wheel of some description would be best for my use along with a 5bar fpr and a good map.

Trouble is you see the billet turbos priced from 5k USD to 2k USD. All claiming to do the same thing!

I have no problem spending money but I'm wondering if there is a premium attached to some of these products? For example an off the shelf map could easily cost £1000. But get Wayne Schofield to do one and it is £400! I know which one would be the better product too!

I'm not for one minute saying AMS turbos are overpriced, I'm just very confused....
 
If you're confused, that's all the more reason you should talk to someone who knows this aspect of the car inside out. I'd only suggest you talk to Ken at 9E and perhaps make a trip down to see his set up and explore the best way forward. I have no connection with Ken but I am in the camp that says, if I don't know about something, then talk to someone who does! And I believe Ken is an expert and guru on tuning 99X turbo cars.
 
ragpicker said:
I now understand that k16s with a billet wheel of some description would be best for my use along with a 5bar fpr and a good map..

If suggest adding GT2RS intercoolers to the list to keep the IAT down on repeated runs and vmax.
 
You either need to talk to one of the top tuners or do lots more research. At a basic level:

-Your car should be checked for boost and oil leaks before you do anything.
-With new turbo's you will likely need a new clutch (unless it's a tip)
-You must remap after fitting new turbos
-A 5 bar FPR is a cheapo solution that is only suitable up to a certain BHP, when you get closer to this you will be running your injectors at high capacity which isn't a good thing. This is all fine at lower BHP.
-Your turbo's will get really hot and the temperatures will end up slowing the car down. You need new intercoolers for this.
-Consider having your coolant pipes welded in with more power
-You should replace the spark plugs at the same time as the remap and turbo's unless just done in a previous service.
-K16 Billets will be an excellent option. If you want cheaper you can always mod your existing turbos but they are very unlikely to be as good.
-This won't be cheap
:grin:
 
cheshire911 said:
If you're confused, that's all the more reason you should talk to someone who knows this aspect of the car inside out. I'd only suggest you talk to Ken at 9E and perhaps make a trip down to see his set up and explore the best way forward. I have no connection with Ken but I am in the camp that says, if I don't know about something, then talk to someone who does! And I believe Ken is an expert and guru on tuning 99X turbo cars.


Ragpicker finally when you've done it all PM cheshire and get him to remap his car :thumb: lol
 
Just a quick point about hybrids. You really have to understand what is actually being offered.

it can be one of 4 things
1) your turbos with just the compressor wheel changed without a refurb to new
2) your turbos with new compressor, and everything is refurbed, or replaced with new parts - e.g. As new
3) turbos supplied as in 1) above and you then send your cores back
4) turbos supplied as in 2) above and then you send your cores back.

Now there is a wide difference in price and you will see this. Number 1 above will work, but I have seen these in poor condition and they won't last too long - this is why they are cheap.
number 2) is the best because they are as new, but clearly you pay more.
Number 3) - no difference to 1)
Number 4) - no difference to 2) but I rarely see this.

In the USA nearly all the turbos are produced by one shop for all the tuners. The approach is number 1 and 3 above.

In terms of turbos
16/24, 24/26 are very old technology
16/16g, 24/18g, 24/20g basically replaced above - mitibushi wheel. Note that a 16/16g outflows an old 16/24

Nowadays people use billet wheels as explained and infact some of the Mitibushi wheels are now billet, sometimes called Xt wheels.

It is very hard to determine the right turbo - as said by Tim, there is a lot of addition hardware - the difference between a k24/18g and k24/20g is huge, and costs probably 10k in additional parts and then you need up rated engine as well.

We ran a k16 turbo in our 9e20 that made 930hp. people said it could not be done, but we made changes to the internals, but retained the k16 housings. There is a reason why the k24 is laggy and it is nothing to do with the compressor wheel. We know why that is, hence why we dropped k24 from most of our packages becuase you can have instant boost and still make the power.

people ask why can you not just put in a larger wheel in a k16 housing - it is all about back pressure - the turbine and compressor must be matched. The point at which it is not, you generated too much back pressure.

It takes time and effort and money to make a good turbo, but the best advice I can give is that don't buy this and that from different places. Go to one place regardless of who that is and buy a package that is proven. There are plenty who do this.

Ken
 
Interesting Ken. I'm having 24/26 fitted as one of my turbo's had stopped working and the cost of rebuilding my K24's is about the same as an upgrade. Fearnsport are doing the work with the turbo's being sent off to AET. No offence to yourself in terms of where I took it, my car went wrong a week or two into ownership and I ended up leaving it with Matt (who's also excellent IMHO).

Anyway...
The 24/26 is the same set up as the 700bhp GT2 featured in 911 and Porsche World, where the comment is clearly around them being there for the purposes of minimal lag rather than going for bigger more powerful turbos. The build isn't a cheap one on the featured car and I just can't see that they'd fit substandard kit to a car like this (IMHO of course). So there must be some merit in the 24/26. Is there something I'm missing?

If this is too controversial don't worry about answering!
 

Forum statistics

Threads
124,311
Messages
1,444,039
Members
49,439
Latest member
markt13
Back
Top