Help - Oil Return Pipe Query!

[andyp]

I've got my lower cam cover off and I noticed something that I think is peculiar about the oil return pipe, and I wondered if anyone can offer some advice?

Basically, one of the oil return pipes was changed at the last service due to corrosion. My indie used the expanding two-piece replacement kit.

Now I've got the cam cover off, I've noticed that this replacement pipe only seems to have half and o-ring seal visible to me (I guess you'd call it a C-ring seal? ;-) ). It's not the case that some of the seal is hidding on the other side, it looks like the seal is cut.

My question is whether this is right or not?

It just doesn't seem right to me and I hope it's not some cowboy installation job. :bandit: But I'm currently fearing the worst.

Andy

 

[clinchy993]

Andy can you take some pics of the pipe and the cam cover ,I am sure with the wealth of knowledge that we have on here someone will be able to help :thumb:

Deep breaths bud !, deep breaths

 

[andyp]

ok, here are some pictures. Bad quality, taken with iphone, but I think you should be able to see my concern.

 

[clinchy993]

From what I understand that seal is a secondary seal as there are 2 two other seals in the expandable part but I dont see why as you say it would be cut or have portion missing

 

[andyp]

it may be a secondary seal and hence not catastrophic that it is not fully functional, but it is not as Porsche designed and I'm sure they put a 2nd seal for a reason.

I've also noticed that there is a jubilee clip, rather than a circlip preventing the tube from collapsing.

This might function, but again its not as per design.

I'm still not 100% confident to leave it as it is.

What do you think?

 

[Dom B]

it may be a secondary seal and hence not catastrophic that it is not fully functional, but it is not as Porsche designed and I'm sure they put a 2nd seal for a reason.

I've also noticed that there is a jubilee clip, rather than a circlip preventing the tube from collapsing.

This might function, but again its not as per design.

I'm still not 100% confident to leave it as it is.

What do you think?

It does not sound or look right to me, personally I would be concerned about any mechanical work that had not been carried out to the correct Porsche specification and would certainly not be happy about having parts fitted to my car that appear to have been modified to aid installation.

It may be worth speaking to a technician at your local OPC to gain a professional opinion and some ammunition before approaching the indie that fitted the tube.
I can't imagine that they would put up much of a fight against putting it right foc.

 

[Jack D]

That isn't fitted properly, the consequences of that just aren't worth thinking about. 2 choices either take it back to the guy who fitted it or to another indie, i know which i would do. The standard of workmanship there just isn't good enough.

Jack D.

 

[andyp]

That isn't fitted properly, the consequences of that just aren't worth thinking about. 2 choices either take it back to the guy who fitted it or to another indie, i know which i would do. The standard of workmanship there just isn't good enough.

Jack D.

Taking it back to the indie that did it in the first place seems a bad option for me, although maybe the least hassle. Extracting compensation from the indie for incorrect fitment and then finding somewhere more reputable might be the right thing to do, but has anyone had positive experiences of doing this?

Andy

 

[guards red]

If I might offer an opinion...

Before we're too hard on the independent specialist, this is a fiddly job to do and harder if the pipe in question is nearer to the rear of the car and the heat exchangers.

Porsche do not specify how far the pipes should be expanded nor do they provide a mark on the tubes to allow one to judge. They only specify which side the inner tube should go on. I very much doubt any installer would remove the rocker covers to check how far it has gone in, they'd check for leaks after installation and that's it.

Bear in mind they need to offer a competitive quote. Done with every precaution in mind one would have to remove the heat exchangers (big gasket costs!) with the huge risk that the studs would break, remove the plastic rocker cover with the additional gasket cost, risk rounding soft allen bolt heads off, risk that the brass inserts the bolts pass through spin in the cover, risk that they warp on removal etc etc.

Assuming that the seal isn't split (not sure if that's a shadow), it's easily solved by your garage, they merely withdraw the tube by a few millimeters. A lot easier than installing the tubes in the first place.

I've seen exactly what they've done many times, have done it myself. Will probably be fine for years but if you want peace of mind, just get them to pull it in a bit.

Just my opinion.

Regards
GR

 

[andyp]

GR - understand the comments and obviously I've never done the job myself so I can't appreciate how difficult it is to get it right.

I'm pretty darn sure the o-ring is cut not trapped - which vexes me a little; and the alarm bells rang!

I'm gonna talk to the indie to get their side of the story next week and we'll see what they have to say about it.

 

[andyp]

Small update. Well I changed the cam cover gasket and hoped that would sort out my oil leaks. However there was still some drips, which I thought were just some ofmthe excess oil in the gasket grooves that remained and it would clear up. Anyway, it turns out that my gasket change probably was successful, as the oil seems to be leaking out of the oil return pipe! Yes, the new one that my indie usefully "installed" to fix my oil leaks! :frustrated:

Now I accept that this may be a difficult service job to do, but it was a job I paid to be done. Really hacked off now that I've spent loads of my own time fault finding something that I paid a professional to fix in the first place.

Very inclined to get OPC to quote for the job and seek compensation from the indie to pay for this. Maybe I should also charge them for my time as well!

I'm off to get a nice strong cup of tea! :x

 

[rottenbend]

PM me if you'd like to know what OPC Byfleet charged me for the same job.

 

[andyp]

UPDATE: well in the end I decided to take out the oil return pipe out that the indie had fitted and replace it with a new one myself. It turns out that the head-side o-ring was indeed in two pieces
Basically, I think they expanded the tube way too far. In doing this, they decided not to use the circlip and used a jubilee clip instead. In all, they just did not follow the fitting procedure.

However, as I have now fitted my new pipe I can sympathise on how difficult this job is to complete. Best described as a very straightforward procedure in theory, but in practise its a complete ball ache! Spent a good few hours under the car completing this and I'm not looking to do this procedure again anytime soon!

Currently bedding in the car now and I've done some short runs and will check if there are any leaks arising.

When I get time I will be approaching the indie and having a quiet word in their ear for some compensation for the new parts I had to buy and also a deduction on some of the labour costs. In the end I'm happy I did the job myself and in the future I plan to do a lot more of the spannering myself as it not only saves money, but I'll be more assured of a job correctly done.

Maybe I'll look on e-bay for a 2 post lift.....