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Another noob question please: Tiptronic in the real world

T

tikkathree

Montreal
Joined
18 Aug 2013
Messages
539
Here's my noob post number 4 (or is it three? five? :?: )

As part of working through what I want my 996 to be I'm interested to know please what are the real world benefits, pros and cons of living with Tiptronic?

I'm not interested in track day heroics, just honest-to-goodness "I live in the UK and drive my 911 all the time" experiences please?
 
At the end of the day it's a pretty standard auto gearbox. If you like Auto then you'll like Tip, if you don't like Auto then you won't like Tip.

As far as Auto boxes are concerned, I've had many auto's in the past and I think the Tip is the best I've driven. It adapts to driving style very quickly, regarding what revs it changes at and the speed of the change is faster than anything I've had before (Honda, Opel, Merc, Ford).
 
T8 said:
Here ya go. :thumb:

==> http://911uk.com/viewtopic.php?t=78825&highlight=tiptronic

NB: My comments refer to my 996 C4.
Click to expand...

Ooooh - good thread! I'm now starting page deux. Cheers.

Now I've read it right through twice. Good thread. So I'm looking for a 996 Cabrio, open to Tiptronic or manual. Maybe I'll get in a Tiptronic and freak out but actually there's almost no chance of that happening.

Thank you T8, that's broadened my options... :thumb:
 
Igurisu said:
At the end of the day it's a pretty standard auto gearbox. If you like Auto then you'll like Tip, if you don't like Auto then you won't like Tip.

As far as Auto boxes are concerned, I've had many auto's in the past and I think the Tip is the best I've driven. It adapts to driving style very quickly, regarding what revs it changes at and the speed of the change is faster than anything I've had before (Honda, Opel, Merc, Ford).
Click to expand...

Well, last I drove an automatic before my 20th birthday and it's my 60th in October so I can't really say that I have much relevant experience. :o

But I am gaining information from the linked thread which T8 has kindly pointed me to.

Thank you for your experience & comments though.
 
Igurisu said:
As far as Auto boxes are concerned, I've had many auto's in the past and I think the Tip is the best I've driven. It adapts to driving style very quickly, regarding what revs it changes at and the speed of the change is faster than anything I've had before (Honda, Opel, Merc, Ford).
Click to expand...
I've had auto boxes in my old W211 E55, C5 RS6 and 996 Turbo. The 911 is the best of the bunch. I thought the Tiptronic really suited the Turbo's torque. I tried a manual and didn't feel it improved the driving experience at all.
 
BillTheButcher said:
I've had auto boxes in my old W211 E55, C5 RS6 and 996 Turbo. The 911 is the best of the bunch. I thought the Tiptronic really suited the Turbo's torque. I tried a manual and didn't feel it improved the driving experience at all.
Click to expand...

I agree Bill, I do get the "more involvement with the car" feeling/sentiment, the wifes MX5 is a manual and I wouldn't change that for an auto. But with the Turbo when out driving for fun I usually only use 2nd and 3rd gears as that covers the speed from 25 - 80 for me. So I don't actually change gear that much even when I am using the buttons on the wheel.
 
Igurisu said:
BillTheButcher said:
I've had auto boxes in my old W211 E55, C5 RS6 and 996 Turbo. The 911 is the best of the bunch. I thought the Tiptronic really suited the Turbo's torque. I tried a manual and didn't feel it improved the driving experience at all.
Click to expand...

I agree Bill, I do get the "more involvement with the car" feeling/sentiment, the wifes MX5 is a manual and I wouldn't change that for an auto. But with the Turbo when out driving for fun I usually only use 2nd and 3rd gears as that covers the speed from 25 - 80 for me. So I don't actually change gear that much even when I am using the buttons on the wheel.
Click to expand...
I think T8 made a similar point a while ago. :)

I understand why people like manual gearboxes - I'm going for a manual in my next car - but IMO the GT-like character of the Turbo (especially a mildly tweaked one like mine was) is better-suited to an auto.
 
Thanks Bill and Igurisu! All input gratefully absorbed!
 
Re: Another noob question please: Tiptronic in the real worl

tikkathree said:
... what are the real world benefits, pros and cons of living with Tiptronic?
... just honest-to-goodness "I live in the UK and drive my 911 all the time" experiences please?
Click to expand...

20,000 miles/18 months/996.2 C4/Tip2. A selection of cons & pros:

Con - Takes time to learn how to use Tip. So, for example, in D you need to learn the various depths, up and down, of the accelerator and to be rough using it. (This is much more than old-fashioned 'kick down'.)
Pro - Tip repays being thrashed.
Con - Tip buttons need more practice than PDK paddles, which are intuitive. The buttons aren't well located.
Pro - Buttons work well for the lower gears on, for example, real-life B roads.
Con - After many years of using a manual, the shift to Tip can be hard.
Pro - For heavy-traffic driving and daily messing about, Tip's a dream.
Con - Perhaps Tip's too clever. Certainly, the D & M combinations are complex to learn to use well.
Pro - It's a lot of fun and actually 'works' very well. Not bomb-proof, nothing is, but apparently very strong, with few reported problems.
Con - Any mention of Tip on 911UK produces a deluge of abuse.
Pro - None. (But I wouldn't go back to manual.)
 
Re: Another noob question please: Tiptronic in the real worl

Tinker said:
tikkathree said:
... what are the real world benefits, pros and cons of living with Tiptronic?
... just honest-to-goodness "I live in the UK and drive my 911 all the time" experiences please?
Click to expand...

20,000 miles/18 months/996.2 C4/Tip2. A selection of cons & pros:

Con - Takes time to learn how to use Tip. So, for example, in D you need to learn the various depths, up and down, of the accelerator and to be rough using it. (This is much more than old-fashioned 'kick down'.)
Pro - Tip repays being thrashed.
Con - Tip buttons need more practice than PDK paddles, which are intuitive. The buttons aren't well located.
Pro - Buttons work well for the lower gears on, for example, real-life B roads.
Con - After many years of using a manual, the shift to Tip can be hard.
Pro - For heavy-traffic driving and daily messing about, Tip's a dream.
Con - Perhaps Tip's too clever. Certainly, the D & M combinations are complex to learn to use well.
Pro - It's a lot of fun and actually 'works' very well. Not bomb-proof, nothing is, but apparently very strong, with few reported problems.
Con - Any mention of Tip on 911UK produces a deluge of abuse.
Pro - None. (But I wouldn't go back to manual.)
Click to expand...

Well this old dog is still up for learning new tricks :grin:

It works well eh? So how come this leads to abuse?

I do recall reading a magazine article by the learned motoring journalist and Porsche fan LJK Setright proposing that an automatic box was a far more intelligent choice for a sports car or grand tourer. This was back in the 60's/early 70s so I can't provide the source but his point was "leave it to the engineers to design the machine to perform at peak efficiency".

Abuse eh? Bring it on! :floor: :floor:
 
Re: Another noob question please: Tiptronic in the real worl

tikkathree said:
Well this old dog is still up for learning new tricks :grin:

It works well eh? So how come this leads to abuse?

I do recall reading a magazine article by the learned motoring journalist and Porsche fan LJK Setright proposing that an automatic box was a far more intelligent choice for a sports car or grand tourer. This was back in the 60's/early 70s so I can't provide the source but his point was "leave it to the engineers to design the machine to perform at peak efficiency".

Abuse eh? Bring it on! :floor: :floor:
Click to expand...

Perhaps the reasons for the abuse* include:
  • No experience of Tip 2 (which, as I've said, takes a long time to learn).
    The belief that Tip is just 'auto' (which it isn't).
    Air-cooled owners seem to see it as somehow 'impure'.
    Generally, manual is perceived as 'manly', 'how sports cars ought to be', and 'engaging' (pun intended).
    Tip is seen as slow (it must be, mustn't it?) and manual as quicker ...
    and so on.
[*Please note that this list is not in praise of Tip, but is some of the reasons why people oppose it.]

It all reminds me of the positive responses that PDK receives, when, actually, most people haven't used it.
 
I'm sorry guys, I have to disagree with the sentence that "people think a tip is an auto", which it is not. I have a Tip Function auto Mercedes E class. That has the option to be used as a fully manual car (not with the buttons on the wheel like the Porsche) but with the stick. It is NOWHERE near the experience of driving a manual. It is an AUTO box.

I am no mechanic but I am led to believe that the early Tiptronic box for Porsche was actually a Mercedes Auto Box. So whilst the torque and engine characteristics of a Porsche are different leading to a different Auto driving experience, a Manual is a Manual and an Auto used in manual Mode is STILL AN AUTO!

To the original poster of this thread - in all honesty Manual vs Tip is a personal preference. There is no right or wrong. There is a lot of marketing Tips on the lines of "it suits the torque characteristics of the engine" etc. Drive both and then make up your mind. Asking others will only tend to confuse you.

One piece of advice is to decide is an Auto or a Manual a deal breaker? If you find the perfect car but its a manual and you wanted an auto, would you walk away and vice versa? For me it was a deal breaker - I only wanted a Manual - personal choice. My daily driver is an auto and 99% of people in for a used Merc E Class expect it in an Auto. Not easy to shift a used Manual Merc. If I was in the market for a used Merc, it would be auto every time.
 
I'm sorry guys, I have to disagree with the sentence that "people think a tip is an auto", which it is not. I have a Tip Function auto Mercedes E class. That has the option to be used as a fully manual car (not with the buttons on the wheel like the Porsche) but with the stick. It is NOWHERE near the experience of driving a manual. It is an AUTO box.

I am no mechanic but I am led to believe that the early Tiptronic box for Porsche was actually a Mercedes Auto Box. So whilst the torque and engine characteristics of a Porsche are different leading to a different Auto driving experience, a Manual is a Manual and an Auto used in manual Mode is STILL AN AUTO!
Click to expand...
:?
 
Tinker:

The belief that Tip is just 'auto' (which it isn't).

Hint: Using an auto box in manual doesn't make it a Manual.

:wack:
 
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