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infrasilver
Fast & Furious
Fast & Furious


Joined: 04 Oct 2010
Posts: 8560
Location: East Midlands

2001 Porsche 996 Targa

PostPosted: Tue Jun 24, 2014 2:03 pm    Post subject: Vibration through car & oil leaking. Update, Engine Fail Reply with quote

I had a vibration through the car at about 6500 revs that has gradually got worse, I drove from Guildford (been on the Top Gear track all weekend) to the East Midlands on Sunday afternoon and the vibration got gradually worse and meant I had to slow from 85MPH over the miles home until I was doing 70 to keep the vibration at bay. All the while I was diagnosing in my head what it could be, I did think maybe the Dual Mass Flywheel had gone and was planning my repair schedule but it wasn't until I got the car home that I noticed I was losing gearbox oil from the bellhousing (I thought it was engine oil initially until I smelt it).

It goes through the gears as it should but the bite point is not feeling great and I can feel a bit of vibration through the clutch pedal, this is my reason for thinking DMF but the gearbox oil leaking has thrown me a little. Could it be a bearing going in the gearbox making the oil seal leak or could the vibration from a shot DMF cause anything in the gearbox to fail and subsequently make the oil leak.
Anyone got any other ideas before I tear it apart?
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Last edited by infrasilver on Sat Jul 26, 2014 8:49 am; edited 4 times in total
 
  
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cheshire911
Estoril


Joined: 10 Jun 2012
Posts: 3866



PostPosted: Tue Jun 24, 2014 7:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

No idea about the mileage, but my money would be on a gearbox seal (and I'm no mechanic by the way).
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DJones
Hockenheim


Joined: 01 May 2011
Posts: 683
Location: Hampshire


PostPosted: Tue Jun 24, 2014 8:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I too would think it's the DM flywheel that's gone. The half that's bolted to the crank would stay in line hence the starter would engage fine and the other side is moving around which in turn is shaking your input shaft about causing the leak on the oil seal.

It's the same dismantle if it's either.

Best of luck with the repair.

Darren.
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infrasilver
Fast & Furious
Fast & Furious


Joined: 04 Oct 2010
Posts: 8560
Location: East Midlands

2001 Porsche 996 Targa

PostPosted: Tue Jun 24, 2014 9:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks for the replies, I guess the DMF could cause the gearbox seal to leak if out of sync enough and may of only got really bad as I got close home, hence the leak on the drive.
I'm not going to get time to remove the box for a week or two so will update later on. I have a spare gearbox so in a way I was hoping it was that just to save a few quid.
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infrasilver
Fast & Furious
Fast & Furious


Joined: 04 Oct 2010
Posts: 8560
Location: East Midlands

2001 Porsche 996 Targa

PostPosted: Sun Jul 20, 2014 11:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Not had much time to look at the car but the last couple of weekends I've had a good poke around and I was quite shocked to find the gearbox totally cracked up one side of the bellhousing and the DMF moving about on the crankshaft mounting enough to wear the internal of the of the bellhousing. I've removed the old DMF, fitting a new one, thinking this has caused the gearbox to shatter only to find that the crankshaft is moving in the engine too. So the result is that the engine is coming out again.

I've spoken to a couple of people and think the crankshaft main bearing is the culprit but unsure of the circumstances, its either the DMF (which isn't bad really) or the gearbox had a weak point and culminated in the main bearing failing due to it shifting about.

Couple of pics so far.












Different picture to last time.


Chain guides haven't worn hardly since they were replaced.


And the bores on 5 and 6 are still okay just showing the same minor marks as they were before.

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Chief
Sepang


Joined: 16 Sep 2010
Posts: 2766
Location: The Middle lands


PostPosted: Mon Jul 21, 2014 12:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hey Chris,
So sorry to read this thread and see you're troubles. I can only offer sympathy, but know how much you love taking things apart, so I shall enjoy all the pics that are sure to be coming our way. Good luck with it Thumb
 
  
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MisterCorn
Dijon


Joined: 08 Jan 2011
Posts: 7485
Location: Nottingham, England

2004 Porsche 996 Turbo

PostPosted: Mon Jul 21, 2014 12:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sorry to hear that Chris, give me a shout if I can help out at all.

MC
 
  
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eca02apc
Nürburgring


Joined: 18 Sep 2012
Posts: 415
Location: Cambs.

2003 Porsche 996 Turbo

PostPosted: Mon Jul 21, 2014 12:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Wow, not seen that before! Most unfortunate. But at least you know what you're doing with it - imagine the garage bill otherwise!

Are you planning any mods whilst the engine is out?
 
  
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alpinaman
Montreal


Joined: 21 Feb 2012
Posts: 589



PostPosted: Mon Jul 21, 2014 3:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

When you say the crank is moving,does it have endfloat?

If so,does it have enough endfloat for the DMF to grind away the gearbox castings? Thats a LOT of endfloat if so...
 
  
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infrasilver
Fast & Furious
Fast & Furious


Joined: 04 Oct 2010
Posts: 8560
Location: East Midlands

2001 Porsche 996 Targa

PostPosted: Mon Jul 21, 2014 10:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Chief you know I love picking up those spanners, just don't like spending all that money again and again. May become picture heavy as I've got some unusual circumstances as usual, DMF had been rubbing on the IMSB cover plate and Crank Sensor so its been going off at all angles.

MC I may be getting in touch, looking for a quick turnaround this time as there seem to be no collateral damage like last time and everything looks brand new in there, as it should I suppose.


IMSB cover where the sensor teeth of the DMF have been touching. See the clean marks above the centre bolt.



And also where it had been catching the Crank Sensor.



Back of the flywheel where it mounts to the crankshaft with corroded part that should be part of the DMF.



You can see the top of the Crankshaft end at a slight angle, the top facing out about 3mm more than the bottom. Even with the vibration and movement that seem to of taken place the updated RMS was still leak free.



It should only be about an hours work now to get to the bare crankshaft and all will be revealed, just need to get back working on it ASAP and start ordering parts.
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infrasilver
Fast & Furious
Fast & Furious


Joined: 04 Oct 2010
Posts: 8560
Location: East Midlands

2001 Porsche 996 Targa

PostPosted: Mon Jul 21, 2014 10:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

alpinaman wrote:
When you say the crank is moving,does it have endfloat?

If so,does it have enough endfloat for the DMF to grind away the gearbox castings? Thats a LOT of endfloat if so...



Not just the gearbox but the back of the engine and it's not so much end float in the sense of the words but just lots of float. Dont know


Open Youtube Page

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Last edited by infrasilver on Tue Jul 22, 2014 8:00 am; edited 1 time in total
 
  
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Chief
Sepang


Joined: 16 Sep 2010
Posts: 2766
Location: The Middle lands


PostPosted: Tue Jul 22, 2014 7:55 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

MAN ALIVE Surprised Chris what the ekie peck is going on here Dont know
If it wasn't for bad luck you'd have no luck at all!!!!
I guess all will be revealed as soon as the case halves are slit.
Keep us posted....
 
  
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skinnedknuckles
Monza


Joined: 04 Mar 2014
Posts: 234
Location: Chester


PostPosted: Tue Jul 22, 2014 8:09 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

seems like you have one of Porsche's prototype rubber crankshafts in there mate. Dont know
 
  
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digby
Trainee


Joined: 10 Dec 2010
Posts: 91



PostPosted: Tue Jul 22, 2014 9:05 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

could be a broken crankshaft - a la BMW ????
 
  
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infrasilver
Fast & Furious
Fast & Furious


Joined: 04 Oct 2010
Posts: 8560
Location: East Midlands

2001 Porsche 996 Targa

PostPosted: Tue Jul 22, 2014 9:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

digby wrote:
could be a broken crankshaft - a la BMW ????


The weird thing is it was still driving, under duress but still driving. I think there is a little more to it than just the bearings.
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digby
Trainee


Joined: 10 Dec 2010
Posts: 91



PostPosted: Tue Jul 22, 2014 9:17 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

A guys 320d did the same thing

made a bit of noise but kept driving

with a snapped crank !!!
 
  
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skinnedknuckles
Monza


Joined: 04 Mar 2014
Posts: 234
Location: Chester


PostPosted: Tue Jul 22, 2014 9:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

digby wrote:
could be a broken crankshaft - a la BMW ????


To get that angle of movement it can only be a broken shaft. I hasn't snapped all the way through though just enough to give that amount of play.

New shaft, new shells and new bearings (which you would do with a new shaft anyway) new bellhousing and a couple of sensors and you are away again.
 
  
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digby
Trainee


Joined: 10 Dec 2010
Posts: 91



PostPosted: Tue Jul 22, 2014 9:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hopefully he will have it open this evening ???

the waiting will then be over Smile
 
  
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MisterCorn
Dijon


Joined: 08 Jan 2011
Posts: 7485
Location: Nottingham, England

2004 Porsche 996 Turbo

PostPosted: Tue Jul 22, 2014 11:01 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I fear a broken crankshaft as well, even if you took a set of main shells out you wouldn't get that much lateral movement.
I'm on my way to Weissach at the moment but wife and kid are in Spain next week and I'm at home so have every evening free (apart from Thursday). If I see a spare 996 crank in the parts bin whilst I am there I will see if I can sneak it in to my hand luggage.

MC
 
  
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quattrosteph
Barcelona


Joined: 14 Apr 2012
Posts: 1430
Location: Buckinghamshire


PostPosted: Tue Jul 22, 2014 11:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

If you need parts or engine/box contact Prestige Salvage in Leeds. Thumb
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