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Osh
Paul Ricard


Joined: 19 Nov 2012
Posts: 3046
Location: Bristol


PostPosted: Mon Feb 10, 2020 5:48 pm    Post subject: e996 Reply with quote

this thread is not about Yorkshire 996’s; you can click back out of it now if tats what you were hoping for... Floor

So, lets paint this forward; 5 years down the road from here and the climate situation is making fuel expensive and the eCar pressure has been ramped up several notches. You’ve just driven to work in your P&J Daily, or had a blast along your favourite backroad to put another big smile on your face – but disaster strikes and the engine squits itself. Its time for a rebuild and your about to contact Hartech … Or do you.

Would anyone consider, instead, ripping out the expired, dead, heart of the old girl, and dropping in an electric motor and battery set up – gives you ‘clean/green’ driving and a new lease of life for says another 10-15 years… Surprised

Anyone heard of anyone ever converting a 911 to electric…?? I know there’s an episode of Wheeler Dealers where Brewer finds a Maserati that’s had an electric engine dropped in it – why not a 911…??

Before anyone sends the 911-Gestapo round to take my knee caps out, I’m just trying to provoke a conversation. THAT’S ALL!!! Grin



Osh
(tin hat mode: ON)
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MisterCorn
Dijon


Joined: 08 Jan 2011
Posts: 7484
Location: Nottingham, England

2004 Porsche 996 Turbo

PostPosted: Mon Feb 10, 2020 5:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I wouldn't. The engine is a big part of the soul of the car.

MC
 
  
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pzero
General
General


Joined: 18 Jul 2010
Posts: 5611
Location: London


PostPosted: Mon Feb 10, 2020 6:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=https://m.youtube.com/watch%3Fv%3DAJLdzRJdKrs&ved=2ahUKEwiigciTysfnAhVZRBUIHRM5DcMQtwIwCXoECAgQAQ&usg=AOvVaw0v41dQM0H1jNux1EJvHRsL
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Bluebird911
Nürburgring


Joined: 29 May 2010
Posts: 463



PostPosted: Mon Feb 10, 2020 6:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

It would be an absolute non starter in my view Osh!!

You could follow the cheap and cheerful 'milk float' tech which I understand was the WD Masterati approach, or the Hi tech modern tech approach.

Both approaches would carry significant weight penalties and the significant weight would mostly be over / beyond the rear wheels resulting in terrible handling.

The WD version had a terrible range if I remember correctly, so is really a non starter.

The best option would be using modern battery tech and motors. They would be prohibitively expensive and present a packaging nightmare if similar range to petrol was to be achieved with a sensible recharge rate; and would be the heaviest 911 ever, requiring significant suspension rework!! Not only that, it would be difficult to package the batteries at floor level to aid handling!!

I read the article where Jaguar were 'trying' to rebirth the e-type using I- Pace innards, and they would have to sell them at £300k!! Their speed matched the 1960's original version, but the weight was a real problem for the suspension and handling to disguise compared to the 'lightweight' original. Harry made this look cool on his wedding day though!!

It's a thought that has often crossed my mind, but I can't really see it happening if a sensible range is to be achieved.

PS, was in Hartech this morning dropping my car off for its service. Didn't see any electric motors on the benches!!

Last edited by Bluebird911 on Mon Feb 10, 2020 6:19 pm; edited 1 time in total
 
  
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Alex
Le Mans
Le Mans


Joined: 06 Mar 2014
Posts: 17340
Location: The Ribble Valley, Lancashire

2000 Porsche 996 Carrera 4

PostPosted: Mon Feb 10, 2020 6:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

It's not as simple as people think. A mate of mine has converted a Smart car to an EV. Great idea until you want the Government to recognise it as a road legal EV. It's turned into a right headache for him trying to sort it out. Add that to all the other headaches he's had to overcome with regards to retro-fitting an electric motor into a car designed to accommodate an ICE. Cost him a fortune and he may as well have not bothered.
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Robertb
Dijon


Joined: 01 Sep 2003
Posts: 7587
Location: South Oxfordshire

2002 Porsche 996 Carrera 4S

PostPosted: Mon Feb 10, 2020 6:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

It’ll probably be relatively easy and cheap in 10 yrs.

Current EV tech is a bit like an early 90s cellphone.
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"911- the guilt-free supercar"

Current: 2003 C4S Coupe, seal/black

Ex: '02 C4S Coupe, '96 993 Targa, '88 Carrera Sport Coupe
 
  
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Dammit
Indianapolis


Joined: 23 Sep 2016
Posts: 2482



PostPosted: Mon Feb 10, 2020 8:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I find the prospect of EV quite enticing for my everyday car requirement (currently an estate with a 5.4 litre VCool, but it doesn't strike me as the right thing for my 996.

I'd rather convert it to run on Methanol.
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fot0
Newbie


Joined: 03 Apr 2018
Posts: 47
Location: Thames Valley


PostPosted: Mon Feb 10, 2020 9:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The engine I aquired as a m96 project is exactly as you describe. The engine failed with intermix issues and sold to me.

The owner is now converting his 996 tip to electric. The motor is from a leaf and sits neatly between rear driveshafts. Not sure how his project is proceeding or complications being met. Apparently, a whole community doing such things out there. We are a dying breed ....
 
  
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UncleP
Monza


Joined: 27 Feb 2019
Posts: 166



PostPosted: Mon Feb 10, 2020 10:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

There's a video on YouTube of an electric converted air cooled targa. In my opinion it's an abomination. The company that did the conversion proudly show off how it now has a boot where that nasty old engine used to be. The frunk... well that now houses about 500kg of batteries. The thing must handle like a pig in high heels. The guy from the company that had done the conversion struck me as being more of an IT/gadget head than someone who understood anything about the pleasure to be had from driving.

I'm fully in to having an EV daily. But when it comes to driving for fun I want 3 pedals and loud noises.
 
  
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Dammit
Indianapolis


Joined: 23 Sep 2016
Posts: 2482



PostPosted: Tue Feb 11, 2020 8:54 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Before I bought my 911 I tried to speak to the company that did that Targa conversion - not to convert a 911, but a Citroen DS.

I thought that the iron-block 4 played no part of the DS's character, but that wafting around on silent electric power would reinforce said character.

However, the company simply never replied to me, which suggested that it's a hobby rather than a business.
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Dagerous
Trainee


Joined: 23 May 2014
Posts: 50
Location: Hamble


PostPosted: Tue Feb 11, 2020 9:11 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I can imagine in about 10 years time (When such conversions become more prevalent and battery / infrastructure has improved from where it is now) I would love the idea of getting a 996C4S as a daily driver. Electric motors front and rear with batteries "Sensibly" distributed. I think that would be great!

I'd still want my ICE 3.4 rev monster Carrera 2 parked next to it though (Which will likely be a 3.7 / 3.9 by that stage!)
 
  
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Marmoset
Newbie


Joined: 27 May 2015
Posts: 34



PostPosted: Tue Feb 11, 2020 10:40 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Agree that the big part of driving enjoyment is in listening to the engine. If the only way to drive it in the future was to convert to EV I would probably just go and buy a Taycan (assuming they drop into an agreeable price range!)

I’m watching this series on YouTube at the moment with a Nissan Leaf motor being inserted into a 996, be interesting to see the performance figures but suspect the top speed won’t be much over 100mph.

https://youtu.be/3FpezUUpSsw

Edit: think this is fot0’s car?
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fot0
Newbie


Joined: 03 Apr 2018
Posts: 47
Location: Thames Valley


PostPosted: Tue Feb 11, 2020 12:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Marmoset wrote:
Agree that the big part of driving enjoyment is in listening to the engine. If the only way to drive it in the future was to convert to EV I would probably just go and buy a Taycan (assuming they drop into an agreeable price range!)

I’m watching this series on YouTube at the moment with a Nissan Leaf motor being inserted into a 996, be interesting to see the performance figures but suspect the top speed won’t be much over 100mph.

https://youtu.be/3FpezUUpSsw

Edit: think this is fot0’s car?


Yep, that's him alright Smile Good find.
 
  
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Wh1t3Kn1ght
Monza


Joined: 22 Aug 2018
Posts: 245


2001 Porsche 996 Carrera 2

PostPosted: Tue Feb 11, 2020 7:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Stopped watching after the annoying bluroscope appeared on the number plates.... Still don't understand why people do this - I mean you don't drive around covering up your number plate do you? Floor
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1990 Panther Black 944 Turbo
 
  
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Alex
Le Mans
Le Mans


Joined: 06 Mar 2014
Posts: 17340
Location: The Ribble Valley, Lancashire

2000 Porsche 996 Carrera 4

PostPosted: Tue Feb 11, 2020 7:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have the ability to see through them - Reg is P30 RME Grin
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77szymon
Spa-Francorchamps


Joined: 14 Mar 2018
Posts: 342
Location: UK

2003 Porsche 996 Carrera 4S

PostPosted: Wed Feb 12, 2020 7:41 pm    Post subject: Re: e996 Reply with quote

Osh wrote:
this thread is not about Yorkshire 996’s; you can click back out of it now if tats what you were hoping for... Floor

So, lets paint this forward; 5 years down the road from here and the climate situation is making fuel expensive and the eCar pressure has been ramped up several notches. You’ve just driven to work in your P&J Daily, or had a blast along your favourite backroad to put another big smile on your face – but disaster strikes and the engine squits itself. Its time for a rebuild and your about to contact Hartech … Or do you.

Would anyone consider, instead, ripping out the expired, dead, heart of the old girl, and dropping in an electric motor and battery set up – gives you ‘clean/green’ driving and a new lease of life for says another 10-15 years… Surprised

Anyone heard of anyone ever converting a 911 to electric…?? I know there’s an episode of Wheeler Dealers where Brewer finds a Maserati that’s had an electric engine dropped in it – why not a 911…??

Before anyone sends the 911-Gestapo round to take my knee caps out, I’m just trying to provoke a conversation. THAT’S ALL!!! Grin



Osh
(tin hat mode: ON)


The only way that make sense to do it is to fit tesla parts but it will cost more then a tesla Smile, I would not even consider leaf parts in 911.
_________________
2003 Porsche 911 996 c4s
1988 BMW 635csi Highline - waiting for full restoration
1999 BMW e36 328i Cabrio - still not finished project.....
2011 Mercedes S350L - SOLD
2004 Audi a2 1.4 tdi - I can't stress enough how good these cars are
̶2̶0̶1̶2̶ ̶M̶e̶r̶c̶e̶d̶e̶s̶ ̶C̶2̶2̶0̶ ̶c̶d̶i̶ ̶E̶s̶t̶a̶t̶e̶ ̶A̶M̶G̶ ̶S̶p̶o̶r̶t̶ ̶P̶l̶u̶s̶ ̶P̶a̶c̶k̶ ̶-̶ ̶w̶i̶f̶e̶
 
  
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Alex
Le Mans
Le Mans


Joined: 06 Mar 2014
Posts: 17340
Location: The Ribble Valley, Lancashire

2000 Porsche 996 Carrera 4

PostPosted: Wed Feb 12, 2020 8:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I wouldn't consider electric full stop. Totally pointless and useless - that's all there is to it.
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cvega
Spa-Francorchamps


Joined: 25 Feb 2013
Posts: 302
Location: Cambridge


PostPosted: Thu Feb 13, 2020 9:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

short range (works for me), maintenance free, cheap to run.. what's not to like?
it's the future sadly!
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2003 996 C2 (Ohlins R&T suspension, Toyosport/Spyder exhaust)
 
  
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DarthFaker
Trainee


Joined: 13 Jun 2019
Posts: 93
Location: 1999 Carrera 4 Aerokit


PostPosted: Fri Feb 14, 2020 9:23 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Electric isn't the future you're all hoping for, I'm an electrical engineer and I have to say things like energy density and battery life will kill electric vehicles off in a few years and we'll have come out with some new filters which make petrol viable again, we've seen electric vehicles come to market multiple times throughout history and they always end up in the can.

There's no infrastructure to support electric vehicles on the level people are expecting, there will always be a place for petrol powered vehicles within our life time, I think city centres will become mostly electric but living in the arse end of nowhere like I do, it's 12 miles to the nearest shop, I don't see it becoming common place, but then again we shoot things to eat out here we're all a bit backwards.
 
  
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Osh
Paul Ricard


Joined: 19 Nov 2012
Posts: 3046
Location: Bristol


PostPosted: Fri Feb 14, 2020 1:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

DF - I disagree. Battery technology is changing at such a rapid rate; in 10-years time we'll be using new technologies that do not use Lithium and capacity will be double or triple what it is today.

Yes, we need investment in infrastructure and production; one of my businesses is involved in solar energy and we've got private funding for £1bn of projects already and money available from US, China and the Middle East to do more.

Further, it wont be long that in-country Gov in many countries will force the write-down of fossil based assets for any company that doesn't have green/renewable power alternatives (thats why BP, et el) are jumping in to Solar in a big way). And thats before you get to companies being publicly graded on their green credentials...

For my part, in 15-20 years time, you'll find half the petrol stations in the country will have closed or converted to fast charging stations.


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