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Do you think the 996 GTS is?
Mad as a hatter project for nut jobs
10%
 10%  [ 2 ]
Interesting but niche
25%
 25%  [ 5 ]
Great but not as porsche intended
0%
 0%  [ 0 ]
Inspired genius, I want one
65%
 65%  [ 13 ]
Total Votes : 20

Author Message
Spinner
Newbie


Joined: 26 Jan 2019
Posts: 7



PostPosted: Fri Jan 31, 2020 9:58 pm    Post subject: 996 GTS Build Reply with quote

Following the creation of an E39 M5 Competition I decided to build the arguably missing 996 model the 996 GTS. Inspired by the 997 and later GTS models.

For those interested here are the thoughts and build.

Why? - have kids, like to tweak, find the GTS the perfect mix between C2 and GT3 for a person who likes fast road, touring and a gentlemans occasional track day

Start? - a midnight blue C4S for the lovely wide body, bum and the fact it already had turbo brakes, larger radiators, stiffer chassis and wider track

GTS Inspired Specification:

GTS Chassis - 2WD Conversion, weight pack minus c.80kg (half this in the conversion approx) approx revised weight c.1,400kg vs c.1,470kg std and C2 at c.1,320kg all circa as dependant on options a bit, uprated engine mounts, GT3 shifter

GTS Engine Protection - deep baffled sump + LTT

GTS Interior - some grey alcantara over grey leather with a few yellow accents

GTS Suspension - Ohlins based, custom spring rates, custom geo, custom corner weight, 30mm wider track, Cup 2 tyres

Review:

Limited miles in the car at the moment mainly due to terrible weather but impressions are as follows. Comfort levels on par if not better than stock. Turn in substantially better. Understeer almost completely eradicated. Weight transfer more controlled. Picks up better with noticeable performance improvement, not massive but noticeable. Steering feel was the surprising winner here, much more communication coming back, a touch lighter also. Not one aspect has a huge change but certainly better than sum of parts. I guess that is the GTS though so perhaps mission accomplished. When the weather gets better I will get some photo's done and a few more miles to really reveal things.

Editing to answer post questions from folks:

- weight: was weighed yes, was 1590kg on scales with 110kg ballast for me plus 2/3 tank fuel plus a half cage of c20kg. So take that all off I get c.1400kg without fuel. If Porsche figures are no fuel also then comparable.
- lsd: I wanted to try car without first as 295 rears are pretty big for the power, I would add a quaife torque sensing as a tweak if needed rather than the plated type in GT3 which is similar to the wave track offering
- pics & driving impressions: I know, keen, believe me!
- power: be interested in folks views on this but doesn’t seem lots can be had so where to go first? 200cel cats might be straight forward for a touch? A hartech 3.9 was clearly top of my list but expensive

Last edited by Spinner on Sat Feb 01, 2020 7:43 am; edited 1 time in total
 
  
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Tourist
Newbie


Joined: 20 Apr 2019
Posts: 8
Location: South-East


PostPosted: Fri Jan 31, 2020 10:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Like the 993 era, Porsche ought to have made a 996 Carrera 2S!

Look forward to seeing the pictures.
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F15hface
Newbie


Joined: 08 Aug 2019
Posts: 6



PostPosted: Fri Jan 31, 2020 10:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I've seen lots of threads where people consider converting a 4S to '2S' but nothing ever comes of it, so good on you for doing it! Looking forwards to pictures, hopefully including ones of the mod process?

You just need to get some lighter rims on and a bit of extra power and then it'll be fully on the formula. IPD plenum and Alleggeritas spring to mind, though I have no clue as to cost or what rims you're currently running.

That M5 sounds interesting too... any thread on it somewhere?

ETA an LSD would also be great and get more of the GTS vibe, especially if you're on track a lot. Hope this is coming off as suggestions and enthusiasm for the car, and not dissing it.
 
  
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HSC911
Dijon


Joined: 23 Jul 2014
Posts: 7042
Location: Bedford


PostPosted: Fri Jan 31, 2020 11:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Good luck to you mate Thumb
 
  
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Robertb
Dijon


Joined: 01 Sep 2003
Posts: 7552
Location: South Oxfordshire

2002 Porsche 996 Carrera 4S

PostPosted: Sat Feb 01, 2020 12:35 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Inspired genius vote from me, following with interest!

Pics and driving impressions please.
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Current: 2003 C4S Coupe, seal/black

Ex: '02 C4S Coupe, '96 993 Targa, '88 Carrera Sport Coupe
 
  
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Dammit
Indianapolis


Joined: 23 Sep 2016
Posts: 2472



PostPosted: Sat Feb 01, 2020 7:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Did you weigh the car after you'd done your modifications?

I ask because my car (C2 cab) lists at 1,395kg but when I weighed it came in at 1,492kg - only 3kg under the list weight for the C4S (1,495).

Therefore, your starting weight may well have been list plus 100kg, depending as you say on options fitted, so it'd be interesting to see how it ended up, and where the weight is in the car.


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MisterCorn
Dijon


Joined: 08 Jan 2011
Posts: 7455
Location: Nottingham, England

2004 Porsche 996 Turbo

PostPosted: Sat Feb 01, 2020 8:13 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

For the 2wd conversion did you convert the front driveshafts to stub axles or change the uprights so you can run the better geometry of the 2wd setup? I assume the front diff and propshaft were pulled to save weight?

I fancy a C4S project next, I think it has the best rear end, and a wide body 2wd NA car was always missing from the 996 lineup.

MC
 
  
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Parsley
Trainee


Joined: 12 Jan 2020
Posts: 54
Location: Hebrides


PostPosted: Sat Feb 01, 2020 8:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Good idea I will watch with interest.
 
  
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Spinner
Newbie


Joined: 26 Jan 2019
Posts: 7



PostPosted: Sat Feb 01, 2020 9:41 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

MisterCorn wrote:
For the 2wd conversion did you convert the front driveshafts to stub axles or change the uprights so you can run the better geometry of the 2wd setup? I assume the front diff and propshaft were pulled to save weight?

I fancy a C4S project next, I think it has the best rear end, and a wide body 2wd NA car was always missing from the 996 lineup.

MC


Both gone yes to save weight and everything capped off. Suffice say there is a right way to do it and several wrong ways. As this is not a garage special I have had professionals and race teams look at all the aspects so I don’t want to infringe their IP. I understand enough to know what to ask and what I want is basically it.

C4S is a great starting point for a project so go for it. 996 present great value for money and whilst the C4S is a bit stronger money you are still getting a lot of car for the money considering a lot of the underpinnings are present in 997/991. The main difference between 996 and say BMW of a similar age is race car for road approach vs road car first. The chassis for the time are excellent so make great bases. The roll cage I installed had negligible impact to chassis and in my opinion only useful to run harnesses (and arguably safety) which is for the slightly more dedicated track goers than me.
 
  
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Robertb
Dijon


Joined: 01 Sep 2003
Posts: 7552
Location: South Oxfordshire

2002 Porsche 996 Carrera 4S

PostPosted: Sat Feb 01, 2020 9:50 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dammit wrote:
Did you weigh the car after you'd done your modifications?

I ask because my car (C2 cab) lists at 1,395kg but when I weighed it came in at 1,492kg - only 3kg under the list weight for the C4S (1,495).

Therefore, your starting weight may well have been list plus 100kg, depending as you say on options fitted, so it'd be interesting to see how it ended up, and where the weight is in the car.



My non sunroof 4s with a full tank of fuel came out at 1553kg on the Center Gravity scales of truth...


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Current: 2003 C4S Coupe, seal/black

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steve r
Monza


Joined: 26 Sep 2011
Posts: 234



PostPosted: Tue Feb 04, 2020 10:53 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

MisterCorn wrote:
For the 2wd conversion did you convert the front driveshafts to stub axles or change the uprights so you can run the better geometry of the 2wd setup?

MC


GT2 or GT3 front uprights rather than C2 would be required to allow the C4S/Turbo callipers to bolt on?
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Shalmaneser
Trainee


Joined: 11 Nov 2019
Posts: 63



PostPosted: Tue Feb 04, 2020 11:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Link to the E39 M3 Competition project please!
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kingroon
Monza


Joined: 15 Oct 2013
Posts: 188
Location: Brighton, UK


PostPosted: Tue Feb 04, 2020 12:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Great idea, especially the usability factor over a GT3..

But..

A respray has to be in the budget..? Carmine Red 996.. Envy
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Roon's Porsche Journal
 
  
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MisterCorn
Dijon


Joined: 08 Jan 2011
Posts: 7455
Location: Nottingham, England

2004 Porsche 996 Turbo

PostPosted: Tue Feb 04, 2020 1:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

steve r wrote:
MisterCorn wrote:
For the 2wd conversion did you convert the front driveshafts to stub axles or change the uprights so you can run the better geometry of the 2wd setup?

MC


GT2 or GT3 front uprights rather than C2 would be required to allow the C4S/Turbo callipers to bolt on?


Yes they would, but there are plenty of other options such as the Cayenne Turbo calipers or later 997 GT3 calipers which fit with adapters.

MC
 
  
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Osh
Paul Ricard


Joined: 19 Nov 2012
Posts: 3043
Location: Bristol


PostPosted: Tue Feb 04, 2020 1:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Spinner - get some piccies up of your P&J m8 Thumb


Osh
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2004 C4S Cab manual - looks the bollox...
 
  
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Shalmaneser
Trainee


Joined: 11 Nov 2019
Posts: 63



PostPosted: Tue Feb 04, 2020 2:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

MisterCorn wrote:
steve r wrote:
MisterCorn wrote:
For the 2wd conversion did you convert the front driveshafts to stub axles or change the uprights so you can run the better geometry of the 2wd setup?

MC


GT2 or GT3 front uprights rather than C2 would be required to allow the C4S/Turbo callipers to bolt on?


Yes they would, but there are plenty of other options such as the Cayenne Turbo calipers or later 997 GT3 calipers which fit with adapters.

MC


WRT to braking improvements I'd be tempted to go for a custom aluminum bell and oversize rotor from Brembo et al along with caliper spacers (and longer bolts, obviously.

It will drop unsprung weight and an increase in disc size will reduce fade and increase power. Win-win.

And it's cheaper than some fancy pants calipers.
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Disco
Estoril


Joined: 13 May 2008
Posts: 3992
Location: Hertfordshire

2010 Porsche 997 GT3

PostPosted: Tue Feb 04, 2020 2:54 pm    Post subject: Re: 996 GTS Build Reply with quote

Spinner wrote:

- power: be interested in folks views on this but doesn’t seem lots can be had so where to go first? 200cel cats might be straight forward for a touch? A hartech 3.9 was clearly top of my list but expensive


Well - if you were aiming for a GTS the way that Porsche would have done it then you want the factory X51 power kit combined with the XLF sports exhaust don't you (the 997 GTS was a wide body with powerkit, PSE, Chrono and a liberal splattering of the options list)? That said, if is officially only 25hp extra and I am fairly confident that sending it to Hartech (which is what I would do in your position) will give much better value.
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Black 997 GT3 3.8 CS - Acquired for the 2012 season and beyond
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kingroon
Monza


Joined: 15 Oct 2013
Posts: 188
Location: Brighton, UK


PostPosted: Tue Feb 04, 2020 3:08 pm    Post subject: Re: 996 GTS Build Reply with quote

Spinner wrote:
A hartech 3.9 was clearly top of my list but expensive

Yeah, such a great concept, spoke to them about it for a prospective 996 Project I had in mind for this year.. £11K+VAT+etc..
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996skid
Newbie


Joined: 19 Sep 2019
Posts: 2



PostPosted: Tue Feb 04, 2020 9:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sounds great! I’m going down the csr route by rpm technik for my c4s, minus the ducktail. Looking forward to it all being finished!
 
  
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Robertb
Dijon


Joined: 01 Sep 2003
Posts: 7552
Location: South Oxfordshire

2002 Porsche 996 Carrera 4S

PostPosted: Tue Feb 04, 2020 9:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

996skid wrote:
Sounds great! I’m going down the csr route by rpm technik for my c4s, minus the ducktail. Looking forward to it all being finished!


Sounds exciting! Has to be worthy of a thread all of its own... food food
_________________
"911- the guilt-free supercar"

Current: 2003 C4S Coupe, seal/black

Ex: '02 C4S Coupe, '96 993 Targa, '88 Carrera Sport Coupe
 
  
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