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crash7
Hockenheim


Joined: 28 May 2011
Posts: 678



PostPosted: Mon Dec 02, 2019 4:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have add some ramblings of how I achieved the install here!

http://911uk.com/viewtopic.php?p=1513804#1513804
 
  
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NedHan79
Hockenheim


Joined: 08 Nov 2018
Posts: 679



PostPosted: Mon Dec 02, 2019 7:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks for the link. Some first class info in there. I just had a quick skim over it but will give it a proper going over when the kids are out n bed.

I’d really appreciate links or the likes or the parts. I had seen the tarret
Pulley before but I have ditched the air con so I’ll worry about that later as I’ll be dropping the engine for other work.
It’ll probably run into more money that expected, it always does but it looks like you found some very handy solutions to the pipe work.
I really like the idea of ditching a lot of the standard pipe work as the air cons going as well. I have a little more chassis work to do so the less clutter under there, the better.
I’m planning on removing the spare wheel but I’ll adapt brackets to allow it to be re fitted if needs be. I’ll probably be keeping the carpet if possible. I’ll have to see how it goes

All the info is greatly appreciated and if you can sus out the dockets for parts numbers that’d be first class.
As you can see I’m not the only one on this idea but was blind. I didn’t even realise I had to cut a hole in the chassis. Floor
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NedHan79
Hockenheim


Joined: 08 Nov 2018
Posts: 679



PostPosted: Tue Dec 03, 2019 6:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Would it be an easier option to cut the high pressure hose somewhere on the rubber part and have a section crimped in with a union or what ever is used, a length of hose, another union and connected to the high pressure hose on the pump? I have a length of hose on the trw pump that was just cut off by the scrap man. All done by a proper hose specialist like Pirtek or whoever is close.

This would not only be a lot cheaper but a lot less waiting time on parts.
Or using the AN-6 method I see a lot on line fixing or replacing hoses. My past experience of AN-6 aren’t great though tbh and I don’t really trust them
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crash7
Hockenheim


Joined: 28 May 2011
Posts: 678



PostPosted: Tue Dec 03, 2019 9:55 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

TBH I am not 100% on what your explaining? – However provided you can get the connections and pipe runs to work you can pipe the pump to the rack any way that suits you.

AN is just a type of fitting, just like JIC, BSP etc, I am not sure what is not to be trusted? AN fittings are made to a tighter tolerance and higher standard than JIC. – AN-6 is the size, this matches the ports in the steering rack.

The Earls PS hose is of a higher standard than the OEM Porsche items, 3000 Psi operating pressure, many moons ago I was involved with a company that manufactured power steering pumps and hoses for Toyota, Landrover, Ford etc, OEM hoses are not tested to 3000 Psi.

AN parts are available from Earls off the shelf and Rebel Racing delivered in a few days. – You are however right in saying that the parts are expensive, the hoses and fittings alone came to circa £200.

I wanted to limit the amount of connections / joins to the absolute minimum, the more crimps, unions etc, the more potential failure modes, I also did not want to reuse any of the circa 20 year old parts.

My hoses are circa 750mm long, the high pressure hose has no joins and is a straight length of triple wire PS hose with a fitting one end and a fitting the other end.

The low pressure hose is the same, albeit with different fittings as a much lower pressure is required, the return at the pump end is held in place with a jubilee clip!

There is no definitive way to do this, the example pictures I posted show different install methods, just be sure that everything is safe and the parts and methods you use are fit for purpose, power steering is a very high pressure circuit and not somewhere you want failures, better, rather than easier, would be my steer.

Good luck Thumb
 
  
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NedHan79
Hockenheim


Joined: 08 Nov 2018
Posts: 679



PostPosted: Tue Dec 03, 2019 10:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I know exactly what your saying crash. It’s not the cost, it’s more the thought of trying to something from the states at this time of year.

On the AN fittings, I went this way making a bespoke fuel set up on my impreza. I was plagued with a smell of fuel at random times. It was possibly down to an injector seal but I never got to the bottom of it and a lot of others told me of similar issues.

I had a bit of momentum going with this build and I would like to get the front end finished so I can move on but I have to admit this has been a bit of an after thought.

But I’m an after thought type of guy Floor
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Rosselder83
Trainee


Joined: 01 Apr 2019
Posts: 59



PostPosted: Tue Dec 03, 2019 1:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

If you want a place that do high quality fittings and can get them to you quickly i recommend torques. He has an ebay shop, is incredibly knowledgeable and ive bought an insane amount of fittings from him with no issues.

Ive done power steering, fuel and breathers all with his fittings and hose without drama.

Just thought id pop that in there, im following this thread with interest, any chance i get to add AN fittings in i usually take it Very Happy
 
  
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NedHan79
Hockenheim


Joined: 08 Nov 2018
Posts: 679



PostPosted: Wed Dec 04, 2019 10:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rosselder83 wrote:
If you want a place that do high quality fittings and can get them to you quickly i recommend torques. He has an ebay shop, is incredibly knowledgeable and ive bought an insane amount of fittings from him with no issues.

Ive done power steering, fuel and breathers all with his fittings and hose without drama.

Just thought id pop that in there, im following this thread with interest, any chance i get to add AN fittings in i usually take it Very Happy


I’ve just seen your reply as I asked on the boxster group as well. I whipped the rack out tonight. I need to look at more pictures to get the mounting position right so I can measure the pipe length. I’ve already said I’m not keen on AN fittings from previous experience.
I also just want to use a rubber type standard hose if possible just to save any scoring of paint. I’ll hopefully have something in place in the next few days if I can get a chance to get at it
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Pauldeacs80
Newbie


Joined: 30 Jul 2019
Posts: 35



PostPosted: Wed Dec 04, 2019 10:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have also done this conversion in recent months. Mega easy. Gets rid of the terrible rust prone Porsche headlines. No difference in feel. Can hear the electric pump ever so slightly when doing things like 3 point turns if the radio is down.

Trw zafira/Astra pump is exactly the same as the Porsche cup pump

Also you can pick up the ignition live and engine running/alternator signal from the ABS pump. Can’t recall the exact wire but I figured it out from the workshop manual wiring diagram. I also got my AN pipe fittings and Teflon pipe from Torques on eBay. Good quality and no issues.

Fittings into the Rac I bought from the USA at a cost of £90 delivered but a few local machine shops told me afterwards that they would of custom made the rack to AN-6 fittings for about £70
 
  
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Rosselder83
Trainee


Joined: 01 Apr 2019
Posts: 59



PostPosted: Wed Dec 04, 2019 11:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Any idea on age / part no of the Zamora pump? I can see me doing this so I’d be keen to stockpile parts now
 
  
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NedHan79
Hockenheim


Joined: 08 Nov 2018
Posts: 679



PostPosted: Wed Dec 04, 2019 11:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I had just planned to get a hose joined on to the original hose with a union and then get the other end to suit the trw pump.

Pauldeacs do you have any photos of whee you mounted the pump and brought the hoses through? I’m thinking either besides or below the abs pump.
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Martin996RSR
Nürburgring


Joined: 08 Dec 2016
Posts: 427



PostPosted: Thu Dec 05, 2019 7:57 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Does anyone know what the hose ends at the rack are? I've emailed ZF/TRW to ask them, but no joy.

I also found this site in the US: https://www.technafitstore.com/Rack-Fittings-s/30587.htm

Perhaps one of those fittings is appropriate?
(This is for me rather than Ned, as he'd rather not use AN fittings, whereas I think I would prefer to, so that I can use entirely new fittings.)
 
  
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Rosselder83
Trainee


Joined: 01 Apr 2019
Posts: 59



PostPosted: Thu Dec 05, 2019 8:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

If those style fittings are appropriate then i noticed the chap at Torques also has those style fittings

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/AN-6-AN6-6AN-to-M16x1-5-Power-Steering-Fuel-Injection-O-Ring-Seal-Adapter/380689531079?hash=item58a2dd40c7:g:ibIAAOxy9DRR-QVA

Might be useful
 
  
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RXBoxster
Monza


Joined: 31 Jul 2015
Posts: 226
Location: Preston - Lancashire


PostPosted: Thu Dec 05, 2019 8:46 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

GMG wrote:
...the pump valving, weighting etc will influence steering feel, will it not ? There will be an engineered synergy between the respective steering components which equate to the sensation experienced at the wheel...

Fiddling with this will corrupt this critical Porsche feature...can't see that a substitution involving a Vauxhall zafira part is going to improve it Dont know


Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing
 
  
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RXBoxster
Monza


Joined: 31 Jul 2015
Posts: 226
Location: Preston - Lancashire


PostPosted: Thu Dec 05, 2019 9:08 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Crap pic of the pump, but you get the idea.

And the blue thing is a steering quickener made by Quaife
 



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MarkGolf
Imola


Joined: 13 Nov 2012
Posts: 796
Location: S.London


PostPosted: Thu Dec 05, 2019 9:17 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

More pics on that car!!

Just to add, as this may help someone. I did a similar thing on a Golf VR6 about 12 years back. I ditched the standard pulley driven PAS pump and went for a Saxo/106 electric pump, it lays flat, rather than upright like the Vauxhall ones. The fluid bottle is remote also, so this pump was really good for being able to be hidden away and having the fluid bottle somewhere sensible. Had it connected to a switch so I could turn it off as and when required.

Pipes were made by Pirtek. Can't remember the relay, running a 20amp fuse.

Hope that's of some use to anyone looking for an alternative pump. Thumb
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NedHan79
Hockenheim


Joined: 08 Nov 2018
Posts: 679



PostPosted: Thu Dec 05, 2019 10:23 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

RXBoxster wrote:
Crap pic of the pump, but you get the idea.

And the blue thing is a steering quickener made by Quaife


I see. I thought that you maybe had a remote fuel tank I tried the pump in the battery position last night but it sits a little to high so the bonnet wouldn’t close.

Martin the pipe fittings for the rack are a push in style. Not like anything else so they’re expensive from the states. $90. I’m going to get Pirtek or someone to join onto my existing rubber hose and just make a low pressure hose myself for the return
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crash7
Hockenheim


Joined: 28 May 2011
Posts: 678



PostPosted: Thu Dec 05, 2019 10:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Martin996RSR wrote:
Does anyone know what the hose ends at the rack are? I've emailed ZF/TRW to ask them, but no joy.

I also found this site in the US: https://www.technafitstore.com/Rack-Fittings-s/30587.htm

Perhaps one of those fittings is appropriate?
(This is for me rather than Ned, as he'd rather not use AN fittings, whereas I think I would prefer to, so that I can use entirely new fittings.)


None of those listed are correct for the rack end, one of them would work for the pump.

The rack side are Porsche specific, picture below shows the shape of what you need, with the acception of cutting up the OEM pipes, Rebel racing were the only items I could find.
 



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RXBoxster
Monza


Joined: 31 Jul 2015
Posts: 226
Location: Preston - Lancashire


PostPosted: Thu Dec 05, 2019 10:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

NedHan79 wrote:
RXBoxster wrote:
Crap pic of the pump, but you get the idea.

And the blue thing is a steering quickener made by Quaife


I see. I thought that you maybe had a remote fuel tank I tried the pump in the battery position last night but it sits a little to high so the bonnet wouldn’t close.

Martin the pipe fittings for the rack are a push in style. Not like anything else so they’re expensive from the states. $90. I’m going to get Pirtek or someone to join onto my existing rubber hose and just make a low pressure hose myself for the return




Yeah its got a 7 litre tank in the back.
 
  
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Shalmaneser
Newbie


Joined: 11 Nov 2019
Posts: 16



PostPosted: Thu Dec 05, 2019 10:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

MarkGolf wrote:
More pics on that car!!

Just to add, as this may help someone. I did a similar thing on a Golf VR6 about 12 years back. I ditched the standard pulley driven PAS pump and went for a Saxo/106 electric pump, it lays flat, rather than upright like the Vauxhall ones. The fluid bottle is remote also, so this pump was really good for being able to be hidden away and having the fluid bottle somewhere sensible. Had it connected to a switch so I could turn it off as and when required.

Pipes were made by Pirtek. Can't remember the relay, running a 20amp fuse.

Hope that's of some use to anyone looking for an alternative pump. Thumb


I remember toying with the idea of doing this with my engine swapped 205 gti.

Ironically the plan there was to remove weight from the front and relocate to the back as it could be mounted under the boot.!
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RXBoxster
Monza


Joined: 31 Jul 2015
Posts: 226
Location: Preston - Lancashire


PostPosted: Thu Dec 05, 2019 11:06 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

There's the fuel tank Smile lol 7 litre, and the car does 6mpg
 



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