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Macca38
Newbie


Joined: 10 Sep 2019
Posts: 27
Location: London


PostPosted: Wed Oct 30, 2019 12:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

benbuhagiar wrote:
Most car dealers are rubbish.

I drive past a used Maserati dealer on my way to work and they have a Red 4200 would caught my attention. Voice mail left and email sent on the 3rd August. No one ever got back to me. I drove past the dealer again this morning and it's still sitting there.

I don't get it.


My own personal view on this that simply any sales person who is decent is working in tech right now. There is a bit of a gold rush on at the minute, lots of jobs paying very high basic wages with great commissions. My first love is cars and I'd love to work selling classics or something similar but there just isn't the money there. If you're leaving school or Uni tech is paying very good wages that most other industries can't match. All the problems mentioned above are traits of bad sales people.
 
  
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FZP
Estoril


Joined: 18 Jan 2015
Posts: 3888
Location: Cheshire


PostPosted: Wed Oct 30, 2019 1:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Coming from the tech side of life, I could count on one hand who I thought were a true end to end sale specialist. Some people are great door openers, some people are great account managers, a few with great tech knowledge, but a few who could cover all bases.
Top sales people in my field would regularly out earn medical professionals or law professionals, for a third of the effort. I do miss it but I don't miss the political dribble of corporate life.
I'd love to make a living from the automotive field, unfortunately it's a commodity item that doesn't off the financial rewards, so attracts a certain level of sales person for the most part, although there are exceptions
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MaxA
Albert Park


Joined: 11 Oct 2015
Posts: 1671
Location: Helsinki


PostPosted: Wed Oct 30, 2019 1:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I am very grateful that I'm not on that new car merry-go-round any longer - neither my wife nor I work for a firm that provides what used to be called 'company cars´ anymore and I don't have to source a new lease car every 1.5 years (we both ran them as the scheme was so heavily subsidised).

Strangely enough, my best experience was from the Ford dealer (I loved my 1st gen 2.0 Focus two door in silver!), and then from the Subaru dealers (those flat six and flat four engines!). Just straightforward blokes. And one VW dealer who managed to sell me exactly what I wanted without cocking it up.

The rest have been plain awful, with the order-taking, the delivery, or the service. Particular low-lights include the Honda dealer who took an order and then a week later delayed delivery by 3 months (it got cancelled), the Mazda dealer who tried to deliver the car with the wrong rims (how on earth did they lose the standard rims?) and the delaer who left me on a Friday night in the rain with a fully deflated sitting-on-the-rim flat tyre ("as it came in like that", really? I think I might have noticed the ***** sparks and the grinding noise). *****.
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deMort
Dijon


Joined: 21 Mar 2015
Posts: 7584
Location: Brighton


PostPosted: Wed Oct 30, 2019 7:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Can i suggest for Porsche .. my old OPC .. Mid Sussex in Burgess Hill ..

Sytner so they have access to other garages to source cars from .

They used to be very sharp on car sales and IMHO new how to treat a customer whether he bought a car or not .

GM is Andy Crabb .. a very nice guy who can help out and perhaps mention iain from the workshop recommended you .. probably won't make a difference but i expect they will still remember me lol .

I can always make a call to some of my former colleagues if needed .
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My Daughter's Crowdfunding has hit the target .

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spongebob squarepants
Long Beach


Joined: 20 Dec 2009
Posts: 6064
Location: Manchester and Iraq


PostPosted: Wed Oct 30, 2019 10:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

deMort wrote:
Can i suggest for Porsche .. my old OPC .. Mid Sussex in Burgess Hill ..

Sytner so they have access to other garages to source cars from .

They used to be very sharp on car sales and IMHO new how to treat a customer whether he bought a car or not .

GM is Andy Crabb .. a very nice guy who can help out and perhaps mention iain from the workshop recommended you .. probably won't make a difference but i expect they will still remember me lol .

I can always make a call to some of my former colleagues if needed .


Im still waiting for a reply from Synter Select in Wakefield Grin the car I was after is still for sale, they just don’t seem to want to sell it Grin
_________________
991 C2S PDK - X51 430 powerkit, Carbon GT2 folding buckets, PCCB, PDCC, PSE, Carrera S alloys, Sports design bodykit with ducktail and Alcantara steering wheel. If Carling did a 991S...
“Herman yellow, the last of the naturally aspirated. ”YKIMS"

Yellow + red = Orange

 
  
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deMort
Dijon


Joined: 21 Mar 2015
Posts: 7584
Location: Brighton


PostPosted: Thu Oct 31, 2019 8:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mid sussex and i can help with .. other Sytner dealers and i can't Sad

Its limited what i can do .. sigh .. i'm just a mechanic im afraid lol .

I have to admit though i'm as frustrated as you guys are .. salesman should be champing at the bit to sell a car and not expect someone to walk in with wads of cash and say i want that one where do i sign !!
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.
My Daughter's Crowdfunding has hit the target .

Thank you all so Very much .

She's not going until july 2020 though .



Mechanic

7pm - 9pm

Now At An Indy.
 
  
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Zingari
Brands Hatch
Brands Hatch


Joined: 25 Oct 2009
Posts: 13077
Location: Cheshire

1993 Porsche 964 Anniversary

PostPosted: Thu Oct 31, 2019 10:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

spongebob squarepants wrote:

Im still waiting for a reply from Synter Select in Wakefield Grin the car I was after is still for sale, they just don’t seem to want to sell it Grin


Perhaps they've heard of you and no-one wants to take on the challenge Dont know
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mikeluke
Kyalami


Joined: 03 Jun 2014
Posts: 1975
Location: Hampshire


PostPosted: Thu Oct 31, 2019 11:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Just remind me again where Wakefield is?

Question Hand
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C4Silver
Spa-Francorchamps


Joined: 14 Aug 2019
Posts: 273



PostPosted: Fri Nov 01, 2019 1:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

deMort wrote:
I have to admit though i'm as frustrated as you guys are .. salesman should be champing at the bit to sell a car and not expect someone to walk in with wads of cash and say i want that one where do i sign !!


That’s the problem, wads of cash and they’re not interested, it seems now they want every last drop on finance, minimum amount in maximum payment every Month.

A few years ago the dealers seemed to help with residuals, monthly’s and amounts to favour the deal. I picked up a Tiguan for my Mrs last week, they’d put Tyre and wheel insurance on the finance, Gap insurance and paint protection !

I made them cancel the crap paint protection as it’s a complete waste of money, that went down well but as they didn’t ask I thought they were taking the pi$$ to be quite honest, I kept the Gap and alloy insurance but made them take it out of the finance so I could pay it in a oner, the mats, boot Mat and a charger cable were also secreted into finance, they had a little pow wow in the office between me scrutinising their behaviour and I very nearly walked out of there while I had to wait with them glaring thro the glass ! My wife just about managed to keep me under control !

I’d specifically said I wanted nothing in the finance except the remaining balance so why they put everything in there including a £16 cable Which attracts interest for 3 years that I’d clearly struggle to pay is beyond me !

I was told a while ago that buying a car in the not too distant future would be like going to a drive thro, you would drive in your PX, walk through a door and drive off in a new one, all the ordering would be done on line and there would be no salesman just a handover ? It makes me wonder if they’re already giving the salesman less and less to do, they don’t ring you back, the finance calculators are all on line, there’s physically very little outlay as they’re only inviting minimum payment ?

I’m just glad to see that it’s not just me who struggles with real world problems !
 
  
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patpending
Imola


Joined: 11 Jun 2018
Posts: 853
Location: IoM


PostPosted: Fri Nov 01, 2019 7:26 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

jonttt wrote:
So a dodgy email comes in from Iraq trying to part ex a car with a Sheffield utd plate on it and you wonder why they did not reply Grin


Maybe the staff are LFC supporters and the desperate mutterings and musings of “Ole’s at the wheel” on the phone and at the bottom of the emails has put them off🤪

On a serious note they are just being ignorant 🤡. I recall the same arrogant attitudes prevailing before the 2009 economic crash when a friend of mine tried to buy/part ex his 3 year old car for a new and mega spec”d RS6 Avant(eye watering cost btw). He had all the cash he needed just sitting in his bank account. He is a warm, very approachable, polite and reasonable family guy.

He absolutely tried everything to do a deal but they showed such disinterest and a lack of courtesy towards him that he gave up with the VAG Group after 25 years of brand loyalty.

The same attitudes appear to be surfacing again within some(but not all dealers) in the prestige car market. if course if you keep bashing away at the door you will eventually get in but it should not be this difficult and when you start to think you are doing them a favour and doing all the chasing it can become almost laughable and time to walk away.

There is a lack of good 2-4 year old Pork doing the rounds at the moment so maybe they can just pick and choose with whom and when it suits them.
 
  
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patpending
Imola


Joined: 11 Jun 2018
Posts: 853
Location: IoM


PostPosted: Fri Nov 01, 2019 7:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

C4Silver wrote:
deMort wrote:
I have to admit though i'm as frustrated as you guys are .. salesman should be champing at the bit to sell a car and not expect someone to walk in with wads of cash and say i want that one where do i sign !!


That’s the problem, wads of cash and they’re not interested, it seems now they want every last drop on finance, minimum amount in maximum payment every Month.

A few years ago the dealers seemed to help with residuals, monthly’s and amounts to favour the deal. I picked up a Tiguan for my Mrs last week, they’d put Tyre and wheel insurance on the finance, Gap insurance and paint protection !

I made them cancel the crap paint protection as it’s a complete waste of money, that went down well but as they didn’t ask I thought they were taking the pi$$ to be quite honest, I kept the Gap and alloy insurance but made them take it out of the finance so I could pay it in a oner, the mats, boot Mat and a charger cable were also secreted into finance, they had a little pow wow in the office between me scrutinising their behaviour and I very nearly walked out of there while I had to wait with them glaring thro the glass ! My wife just about managed to keep me under control !

I’d specifically said I wanted nothing in the finance except the remaining balance so why they put everything in there including a £16 cable Which attracts interest for 3 years that I’d clearly struggle to pay is beyond me !

I was told a while ago that buying a car in the not too distant future would be like going to a drive thro, you would drive in your PX, walk through a door and drive off in a new one, all the ordering would be done on line and there would be no salesman just a handover ? It makes me wonder if they’re already giving the salesman less and less to do, they don’t ring you back, the finance calculators are all on line, there’s physically very little outlay as they’re only inviting minimum payment ?

I’m just glad to see that it’s not just me who struggles with real world problems !


It is great though when you deal with a salesperson who really knows his/her stuff and takes your money without protest and because the whole buying experience has been a terrific one.

They can make the feel good factor a reality.
 
  
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Hertsdriver
Nürburgring


Joined: 12 Nov 2018
Posts: 472
Location: Hertfordshire/London

2004 Porsche 997 Carrera 2

PostPosted: Fri Nov 01, 2019 12:29 pm    Post subject: Re: Another crap dealer thread!!! Reply with quote

spongebob squarepants wrote:
Ok so after weeks without internet, then disorder and chaos in Baghdad, now sat in an undisclosed venue in the Iraqi desert, its hot, its thundering, its lightning, its infested with flies, but most of all there's now no electricity to go with the limited internet. nooo

So car dealers. FFS. A trio of 991 Turbo's have caught my interest and could possibly sway me away from my beloved Herman. In reality I cant really afford it and know the px offer will be dogs, however it would be nice to find out!

Having contacted 3 dealers, nothing! Having made it very clear I cant talk on the phone for hrs, with basic stuff that can be done in an e. mail- Nothing!

How hard can it be???? I want your car, and I want to px mine? Give me a ball park? Well talk finance, ill go to someone who'll give me 3% cheaper, and well hopefully do a deal!!! Ive done it like this many times, with 911V, Redline, Ashgood etc and several OPC's.

But no instead well just ignore you! I dont get it, i mean id ignore me, but they dont even know me yet to make that decision! The cars im looking at are still available, its not as if they are sold , and they arent even Yorkshire cars!

Porsche (and car dealers generally) its just not good enough, how hard can it be FFS! Strangely one of the 'dealers' does a 'we buy your car. com' and guess what? I had a ***** offer in hours!


Let me see if I can get this straight...

1. You have emailed several dealers about cars they have for sale and you have explained you are abroad.
2. You expect them to give you part ex prices on car they havnt seen.
3. You believe you have received poor service because they havnt got back to you.

Are you on drugs? No dealer in their right mind would commit to anything over email which I am sure you understand as you talk about 'ball park', so stop pissing about wasting their time while you are bored at work.

There is no way on earth you would buy a car just purely based on an email conversation, so get back to the uk, drive to the dealers, let them appraise your car, drive their car and do a deal.

I spent 10 years selling cars, and nothing is more annoying than wasting time with a man from abroad who has access to the internet and is bored Floor

To be fair, I would have at least emailed you to let you know that I was very interested in your car as I have a potential buyer waiting for a yellow one (which would be *****, but make you think you will get a good deal). I would let you know that I wouldn't be able to give you any prices until I see it, I would maybe suggest WBAC if you wanted a market ballpark worst case figure, but let you know that we would definitely be able to beat that easily once we had seen it, and tried to arrange an appointment for you to come down. Lastly I would have let you know that there are 2 other people also discussing the car you are looking at (also *****), and ask you to please come back quickly with a definite appointment, but I would let you know if it sold. Thumb
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spongebob squarepants
Long Beach


Joined: 20 Dec 2009
Posts: 6064
Location: Manchester and Iraq


PostPosted: Fri Nov 01, 2019 12:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

mikeluke wrote:
Just remind me again where Wakefield is?

Question Hand


Ah yes Yorkshire I believe Grin I doubt a Yorkshire dealer would conduct a deal in this way! Strangely contrary to belief ive done deals this way several times with real dealers on trust, 911V, OPC Belfast, OPC Leeds to name a few.

Ive never viewed a car prior to sale, and the dealer has not seen mine prior to the deal, honesty prevails and if its wrong on either side it doesnt work obviously, for most car dealers (and salesman, previous included) this stuff is rocket science of course Thumb Rolling Eyes
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991 C2S PDK - X51 430 powerkit, Carbon GT2 folding buckets, PCCB, PDCC, PSE, Carrera S alloys, Sports design bodykit with ducktail and Alcantara steering wheel. If Carling did a 991S...
“Herman yellow, the last of the naturally aspirated. ”YKIMS"

Yellow + red = Orange

 
  
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C4Silver
Spa-Francorchamps


Joined: 14 Aug 2019
Posts: 273



PostPosted: Fri Nov 01, 2019 3:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I was gonna say, I’ve just bought a car over email and I’m not on drugs,

I changed my D5 3 weeks ago and he gave me a price on mine, sent me all the relevant details on the new one all via the medium of honesty and integrity.....
I’ve been buying LR’s from the same place for 20 years mind,
I’ve had 4 Porsche’s, two cayennes a Macan and a Panamera from Silverstone all done via email ?

The problems I’ve been encountering are from franchised dealers like Evans Halshaw, JCT600, Marshall’s, Sytner etc, all wanting market dominance, All registering vehs and selling them as new, all wanting you to take finance under their terms and conditions, they’re registering cars to meet targets but using them as personal transport whilst racking up the miles and refusing to reduce the price whilst running round in them.

Call it perks of the job, salesman’s prerogative or whatever other terminology they want but advertising a car with 23 miles on the clock, traveling an hour to go and see it to find out it’s not there because the salesman has a week off and he’s gone on holiday in it......it’s been pretty registered. and it’s actually got 3,200 miles on the clock ! Is mis selling ! They don’t want it because they’re enjoying joy driving it !

One salesman even told me he didn’t want to sell it because he’d waited a year to spec the car exactly how he wanted it and he’d barely driven it
His Mrs liked it........ and he was going to a wedding in wales next week in it !

I think he was on drugs !
 
  
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Hertsdriver
Nürburgring


Joined: 12 Nov 2018
Posts: 472
Location: Hertfordshire/London

2004 Porsche 997 Carrera 2

PostPosted: Fri Nov 01, 2019 3:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Bad example C4 if you have dealt with the same dealer for x years, the OP was randomly emailng dealers he has never bought cars from before - not the same thing.
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jonttt
Long Beach


Joined: 20 Aug 2012
Posts: 6447
Location: Liverpool


PostPosted: Fri Nov 01, 2019 3:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hertsdriver wrote:
Bad example C4 if you have dealt with the same dealer for x years, the OP was randomly emailng dealers he has never bought cars from before - not the same thing.


But the OP has done just that before, successfully Hand

and you have never had the pleasure of correspondance from the Sponge Grin
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spongebob squarepants
Long Beach


Joined: 20 Dec 2009
Posts: 6064
Location: Manchester and Iraq


PostPosted: Fri Nov 01, 2019 4:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

jonttt wrote:
Hertsdriver wrote:
Bad example C4 if you have dealt with the same dealer for x years, the OP was randomly emailng dealers he has never bought cars from before - not the same thing.


But the OP has done just that before, successfully Hand

and you have never had the pleasure of correspondance from the Sponge Grin


Hmm yes strangely with 911V, Redline, OPC Leeds, OPC Belfast, and countless deals on cars other than Porsche for the first time it wasn’t an issue Rolling Eyes

Equally strangely companies like WBAC have even made a business making offers on cars unseen! madness Rolling Eyes
_________________
991 C2S PDK - X51 430 powerkit, Carbon GT2 folding buckets, PCCB, PDCC, PSE, Carrera S alloys, Sports design bodykit with ducktail and Alcantara steering wheel. If Carling did a 991S...
“Herman yellow, the last of the naturally aspirated. ”YKIMS"

Yellow + red = Orange

 
  
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C4Silver
Spa-Francorchamps


Joined: 14 Aug 2019
Posts: 273



PostPosted: Fri Nov 01, 2019 7:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hertsdriver wrote:
Bad example C4 if you have dealt with the same dealer for x years, the OP was randomly emailng dealers he has never bought cars from before - not the same thing.


Yes i know..... Thats why my response earlier on the thread highlighted my Experience of trying to Puchase a mid sized SUV for my wife from various different manufacturers...... None of them could be bothered and in the end i took the Finance route just to bring an end to the saga,

I too had emailed them...... Rang them...... sometimes i couldnt even get the receptionist to pick up the phone, getting past the front desk is often a chore.... I'm not imparting my hatred of car dealers firmly at their door, some of the problems were from my own doing, i hadnt realised that the process of buying a car had changed so much in the last few years, there was a time when you could buy a car cash, now the incentives are based around the finance package, gap insurance, paint protection of all things, all clumped togethr and bobbed onto the finance package, my guess is the salesman / woman used to get paid for selling cars, now they get paid for selling finance, which they dont actually do because they have to hand you over to some one who is actually regulated to do so........ which brings me back the point i was trying to make...... Surely it's only the people who dont know what car they want to talk to some one who can sell them a car, It seems that if you know what you want and have a basic understanding of how the internet functions you can actually buy a car from the other end of the country or even the world without even clapping eyes on it ! and not even having to take to take any drugs,

The problem with working overseas is that your time off is best spent with people who you want to be around Family, Freinds etc, when you get back home and not talking to car salesmen in Cheap Suits and pointy fronted shoes...... The idea that a salesman could possibly do their job and line stuff up for when you get back is basically what they are supposed to do..... It's their job.....

A bit like relying on me to do my job and then when it all goes wrong because i cant be bothered i blame emails and drugs....... and people with too much time on their hands.......Which to be honest is basically where it all does go wrong.....
Question
 
  
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Hertsdriver
Nürburgring


Joined: 12 Nov 2018
Posts: 472
Location: Hertfordshire/London

2004 Porsche 997 Carrera 2

PostPosted: Mon Nov 04, 2019 9:52 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yes car selling in general is very different now.
The internet makes everyone an 'expert', and the car discounters mean there is no longer any profit in new cars unless you are selling something that doesnt require discounting (and there arent many of those around).
There is still plenty of profit in used car sales, possibly even more now that WBAC has helped people understand that they wont get forecourt prices in part ex. Of course WBAC will always kick you in the nuts and hope that they make some profit when the car goes through the block, very few people actually get paid the full quoted amount from WBAC (they will all tell you they do as nobody likes to be shown up, but they knock everyone when the cars actually turn up on site).

I'm glad I'm long out of it and feel sorry for anyone left in. There are some good people left, but most of them (as you have found) are disinterested muppets.
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C4Silver
Spa-Francorchamps


Joined: 14 Aug 2019
Posts: 273



PostPosted: Mon Nov 04, 2019 10:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

In all seriousness I must be one of the only people who WBAC are targeting Successfully?

For me it is a sure fire way of disposing of a car without having some one chipping away at you on price, ringing you at 8 o’clock on Saturday night asking if they can come thro on Sun morning to then not turn up, once it’s gone I’ve played my part and they’ve done their job, anything after that I don’t know about and have absolutely no interest in how much money they make, it’s passed on to a used car dealer after that and then again has to be made money on, good luck to them.......

I’ll tell you one thing for sure....... I wished I’d had the inclination to put that lot together on the internet and have people bring their cars to me, I noticed about 6 years ago when I PXed a Discovery the dealer offered me less than WBAC because they had costs incurred getting it to them and that they set the pressident on market valuations.
I drove it there myself and then asked for more money off, I am from Yorkshire......

I read over the weekend that new car sales are down 20% ! Make no bloody wonder with the hoops you have to jump through to get any one interested in selling you one. Buying a car is quite stressful...... or at least I just found it to be, I bought a 997 privately and can honestly say I thoroughly enjoyed the whole experience, I changed my Disco 5 for something a few months ago and neither created anywhere near the amount of pallava that this last one brought.....
👹

Your right though, the people left in are not naturally gifted in the art of sales technique, on
 
  
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