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moss
Hockenheim


Joined: 14 Jun 2010
Posts: 632
Location: farnham

2001 Porsche 996 Carrera 4

PostPosted: Thu Jul 11, 2019 10:46 am    Post subject: rights when selling a car Reply with quote

hi all, i sold a car over 2 months ago to a dealer, he has now come back to me stating faults. which where unknown to me a the time, and is asking i pay for the repairs ! ive told him the car was sold as is, with no warranty given as im a private seller, but hes quoting some 1975 law that states i have mis sold him a car ! rich coming from a dealer.. and now hes actually threatening to go legal on me unless i pay up,. Ive bitten my tongue and stated again and again i didn't know of any faults ( i really didn't ) and the car was sold as seen, private sale.. Ive searched and found info that says he hasn't a leg to stand on ans is more than likely just trying it on, bully boy dealer tactics..
can anyone offer any advice on this please ?
thanks in advance Thumb
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G2
Barcelona


Joined: 26 Oct 2015
Posts: 1492



PostPosted: Thu Jul 11, 2019 10:52 am    Post subject: Re: rights when selling a car Reply with quote

moss wrote:
hi all, i sold a car over 2 months ago to a dealer, he has now come back to me stating faults. which where unknown to me a the time, and is asking i pay for the repairs ! ive told him the car was sold as is, with no warranty given as im a private seller, but hes quoting some 1975 law that states i have mis sold him a car ! rich coming from a dealer.. and now hes actually threatening to go legal on me unless i pay up,. Ive bitten my tongue and stated again and again i didn't know of any faults ( i really didn't ) and the car was sold as seen, private sale.. Ive searched and found info that says he hasn't a leg to stand on ans is more than likely just trying it on, bully boy dealer tactics..
can anyone offer any advice on this please ?
thanks in advance Thumb


What is the dealer name?
 
  
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jboy
Trainee


Joined: 30 May 2017
Posts: 87



PostPosted: Thu Jul 11, 2019 11:00 am    Post subject: Re: rights when selling a car Reply with quote

moss wrote:
hi all, i sold a car over 2 months ago to a dealer, he has now come back to me stating faults. which where unknown to me a the time, and is asking i pay for the repairs ! ive told him the car was sold as is, with no warranty given as im a private seller, but hes quoting some 1975 law that states i have mis sold him a car ! rich coming from a dealer.. and now hes actually threatening to go legal on me unless i pay up,. Ive bitten my tongue and stated again and again i didn't know of any faults ( i really didn't ) and the car was sold as seen, private sale.. Ive searched and found info that says he hasn't a leg to stand on ans is more than likely just trying it on, bully boy dealer tactics..
can anyone offer any advice on this please ?
thanks in advance Thumb


This dealer sounds like the class clown. So what if you knew of any faults anyway, that is on your conscience but that is what the "dealer" margin is for. They are experienced, in the trade, able to inspect a car should they wish, and the price you received will be poor relative to market and reflective of this. Same as if you sell private to private, no warranties are implied either. Caveat emptor.

BUT the law is obviously a bit trickier to navigate where you have provided any express warranty or assurances as to condition or roadworthiness on the sale, which might alter the situation somewhat..... One does have to be carfeful describing anything as "mint" or "in good condition" or "drives like new" because they can all come back to haunt you.......

If you have any particular concerns about things you may have said verbally or in writing, feel free to PM me....
 
  
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T8
General
General


Joined: 29 Jun 2010
Posts: 15972
Location: Kent


PostPosted: Thu Jul 11, 2019 11:01 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

You sold your car to a dealer.

He bought it.

End of story.
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FZP
Estoril


Joined: 18 Jan 2015
Posts: 3707
Location: Cheshire


PostPosted: Thu Jul 11, 2019 11:21 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Perhaps this is what he's referring to.

"The most significant of these is the Sale of Goods Act 1979 (as amended). This gives buyers a remedy (like a refund, replacement or damages) if they are sold goods which are not of satisfactory quality, consistent with their description and fit for purpose.

However, there are many exceptions to the Act, notably:

Auction sales (in most cases)
When the seller is a private individual
Sale of real estate"

I'd be giving him the big on. Who knows what's happened to the car since they've had it.

But for clarity, did you sell a car to him that has since been discovered to have borescore when a new owner did a PPI?

I can't imagine the dealer getting in a rage unless it was a big bill like an engine rebuild.
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Jay.
Montreal


Joined: 20 Oct 2015
Posts: 579
Location: Brize Norton


PostPosted: Thu Jul 11, 2019 11:40 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I believe the Consumer Rights Act (2015) is mainly used against car dealers. As a private seller:

Quote:
There is no legal requirement for a car to be of satisfactory quality or fit for purpose.

But contractual rules about misrepresentation do apply. So, legally, the seller must:

1) accurately describe the second-hand car. For example, an ad must not say 'one owner' when the car has had several
2) not misrepresent the second-hand car, ie tell you something about it which isn't true. For example, if it’s been in an accident, the owner mustn't tell you it hasn't.

If you're buying from a private seller, the onus is on you as the buyer to ask all the right questions before making the purchase.

The seller doesn't have to volunteer extra information so, if you don't ask questions, you may not have the full picture of the car's history or be aware of any potential faults.


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moss
Hockenheim


Joined: 14 Jun 2010
Posts: 632
Location: farnham

2001 Porsche 996 Carrera 4

PostPosted: Thu Jul 11, 2019 12:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

thanks for reply, no nothing like that, its a cayenne turbo, hes bought, its apparently not showing a engine management light at start up, so hes claiming it should not have passed a mot in april for this, bear in mind he bought it begginning may its now july... and hes starting getting a maybe i removed the bulb ! why would i ? and besides im pretty sure these have soldered leds on the dash, not the old fashioned bulbs, so hes saying i sold him a car thats not fit for the road, ie a mot fail.. which i didnt declare at time of sale .. which i had no idea about.. i do feel hes just trying it on as a dealer who probably wont make the mark up he wanted.. but he states he is going legal on me, so i need to have a reply and be ready i guess... im not paying him a penny.


FZP wrote:
Perhaps this is what he's referring to.

"The most significant of these is the Sale of Goods Act 1979 (as amended). This gives buyers a remedy (like a refund, replacement or damages) if they are sold goods which are not of satisfactory quality, consistent with their description and fit for purpose.

However, there are many exceptions to the Act, notably:

Auction sales (in most cases)
When the seller is a private individual
Sale of real estate"

I'd be giving him the big on. Who knows what's happened to the car since they've had it.

But for clarity, did you sell a car to him that has since been discovered to have borescore when a new owner did a PPI?

I can't imagine the dealer getting in a rage unless it was a big bill like an engine rebuild.

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kas750
Shanghai


Joined: 31 Mar 2013
Posts: 4524
Location: Chorley lancashire

2006 Porsche 911

PostPosted: Thu Jul 11, 2019 12:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Email him a link to this thread and the Gmund thread and I am sure you will hear nothing further. Bandit Thumb
 
  
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MarkGolf
Imola


Joined: 13 Nov 2012
Posts: 751
Location: S.London


PostPosted: Thu Jul 11, 2019 1:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Idiot!

He should know better but he's clearly trying his luck.

If it's been fine for a couple months and the engine light only just came on, what the hell is he smoking thinking he has a leg to stand on.

Tell him to ***** off and get a crystal ball obd2 code reader next time.
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Counter Of Beans
Spa-Francorchamps


Joined: 10 May 2018
Posts: 347
Location: Hampshire


PostPosted: Thu Jul 11, 2019 4:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

From what you say, he has absolutely no case against you whatsoever.
I would tell him that any further contact from him will be regarded as harassment that will be reported to the police, then have no further contact with him.
He's trying to bully you into paying. Don't fall for it, and if he says he'll "get legal" just ignore it, because it's an empty threat.
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991.2GTS
Spa-Francorchamps


Joined: 02 Apr 2019
Posts: 325
Location: Yorkshire


PostPosted: Thu Jul 11, 2019 4:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The sale of goods act only safeguards consumers, not businesses. Tell him to take a running jump.....
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jonttt
Long Beach


Joined: 20 Aug 2012
Posts: 6227
Location: Liverpool


PostPosted: Thu Jul 11, 2019 7:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Keep evidence of his “communication” and give him a cease and desist notice under the harassment act, usually works a treat Grin
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Hamster75
Spa-Francorchamps


Joined: 07 Sep 2017
Posts: 324
Location: Chester


PostPosted: Thu Jul 11, 2019 7:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I wouldn't entertain him, willing seller & willing trade buyer, don't elaborate in protracted emails, the 2-3 months on is too late for a dealer to come back on you.
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Disco
Estoril


Joined: 13 May 2008
Posts: 3964
Location: Hertfordshire

2010 Porsche 997 GT3

PostPosted: Thu Jul 11, 2019 11:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ask if the letters F O mean anything to them. Seriously - this is a chancer trying to intimidate you into giving them something to which they are not entitled for free.
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Kryton
Nürburgring


Joined: 05 Mar 2005
Posts: 403



PostPosted: Fri Jul 12, 2019 8:18 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

So the car had been working fine for 2 month's, as others have said tell him to 'jog on' Rolling Eyes

Who is the dealer?
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easternjets
Watkins Glen


Joined: 29 Apr 2016
Posts: 2115
Location: Darlington


PostPosted: Fri Jul 12, 2019 9:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

'Removed the bulbs to get it through an MOT' what a clown!

I wouldn't get into a correspondence 'tennis match' with him, send him one final email or letter, preferably the latter by recorded delivery and state that the car was road worthy and legally MOT'd when he bought it and that's your final word.

If he does have the 'neck' to take you to court make sure you turn up but I very much doubt he will.
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squelch
Nürburgring


Joined: 05 Jun 2016
Posts: 490
Location: Bucks


PostPosted: Fri Jul 12, 2019 9:28 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

He's chancing his arm and has no recourse whatsoever since he buys and sells in the course of his business. So the law sees him as a professional car buyer with supposed superior knowledge than Joe Public. If a case ever found its way to court (or ADR / arbitration) he will be simply told to be better at the buying aspect of his business. He had the opportunity to do his due diligence and to have missed an absent management light when the ignition is on just shows how poor he is at his job. He caught a cold, and that's just a risk of the business he is in and now he is lemony. Frankly he's a fool for even trying it on. I'm not really one for crying to the authorities but in this case, if he persists you should report him for harassment (or burn down his dealership to focus his attention elsewhere - that's a joke by the way, before you go reaching for the Swan Vestas).

So, in summary: tell him GFY!
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pzero
General
General


Joined: 18 Jul 2010
Posts: 5443
Location: London


PostPosted: Fri Jul 12, 2019 10:06 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

T8 wrote:
You sold your car to a dealer.

He bought it.

End of story.


Yeah

And a big fat +1 to all the other comments above.
It would be good to know the dealer.....
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