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pietrzj
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Joined: 19 Mar 2014
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PostPosted: Sat Jun 01, 2019 7:43 pm    Post subject: Gearbox rebuilder in South or South West? Reply with quote

Hi,

I need to get my C2 gearbox rebuilt as I am fed up with the crunch into second gear when cold and the slack and clunking in the overall drive train on when on and off the power. I have worn drive shafts too, but with the car jacked up the excessive play is visible when you manually turn the rear wheels slowly clockwise then anti-clockwise to take up the slack when in first gear. It extends into the gearbox much more than I think is normal and is not just due to the worn CV joints.

The car has done over 170K with no history of a rebuild, so its probably about time.

I will get my local garage to remove the box and I would like to know if you have any recommendations for where to get it overhauled & rebuilt?

My closest Porsche specialists are JMG Porsche in Bornemouth and Canford Classics, but would like at least 4 to contact.

Any suggestions?


Jan
 
  
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toddy2
Spa-Francorchamps


Joined: 11 Jan 2015
Posts: 363
Location: Dorset


PostPosted: Sun Jun 02, 2019 3:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Have you tried Eddie at Silvertune in Christchurch. He’s my preferred in the area.
Mines probably due a rebuild so I’d be keen to know how you get on....
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AP90
Nürburgring


Joined: 25 Sep 2004
Posts: 387
Location: Cornwall UK


PostPosted: Sun Jun 02, 2019 6:54 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi Jan

Try Williams Crawford in Saltash, just over the Devon border in Cornwall

They do a lot of renovation work

https://www.williamscrawford.co.uk

They're not particularly cheap tho'
 
  
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pietrzj
Spa-Francorchamps


Joined: 19 Mar 2014
Posts: 274



PostPosted: Sun Jun 02, 2019 4:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

What are my replacement options? I expect a replacement box if available from Porsche at all would be far too expensive, but are there any reputable Porsche Gearbox refurbishers out there that anyone has experience of (directly or indirectly)?
 
  
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Endoman
Barcelona


Joined: 11 Apr 2011
Posts: 1402
Location: Bolton U.K.


PostPosted: Sun Jun 02, 2019 7:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Unfortunatley none local to you, Unit 11 did Trev's gearbox, Cath Burrows knows her way around them and http://www.mbporsche-engineering.co.uk/ have a good reputation, a bit closer Tuthills https://www.tuthillporsche.com/

I have rebuilt a few in the past and if you have the right tools it's pretty straightforward, but they weren't Porsche gearboxes.
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Cameltoe & Heel
Barcelona


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 03, 2019 7:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

something I'd love to have a go at for sure...parts are super expensive, ask me how I know Smile

Trev
 
  
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nickjonesn4
Montreal


Joined: 10 Aug 2017
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Location: Edinburgh


PostPosted: Mon Jun 03, 2019 10:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I had this done last year at RPM Technik in Long Marston. They have a specialist gearbox guy who is excellent. They did an incredible job. Lots of pictures here if it helps.

I was sufering very similar problems to you and I now have an "as new" gearbox

http://911uk.com/viewtopic.php?t=124270&postdays=0&postorder=asc&highlight=nick&start=60
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cheshire911
Estoril


Joined: 10 Jun 2012
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 03, 2019 5:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

AP90 wrote:
Hi Jan

Try Williams Crawford in Saltash, just over the Devon border in Cornwall

They do a lot of renovation work

https://www.williamscrawford.co.uk

They're not particularly cheap tho'


Do they actually do the job or outsource it someone else? I was always under the impression they use other people in the renovation and are more caretaking and over-seeing the job rather than rolling their sleeves up and doing it themselves. But I could be wrong and they have ventured into a new area of repairing and rebuilds. An earlier post mentioned Unit 11 and Cath Burrows both of whom are in the North-West - both very good and Unit 11 is probably the go-to guy for air-cooled Porsche and Cath is certainly very good across the range.
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AP90
Nürburgring


Joined: 25 Sep 2004
Posts: 387
Location: Cornwall UK


PostPosted: Mon Jun 03, 2019 7:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

cheshire911 wrote:
AP90 wrote:
Hi Jan

Try Williams Crawford in Saltash, just over the Devon border in Cornwall

They do a lot of renovation work

https://www.williamscrawford.co.uk

They're not particularly cheap tho'


Do they actually do the job or outsource it someone else? I was always under the impression they use other people in the renovation and are more caretaking and over-seeing the job rather than rolling their sleeves up and doing it themselves. But I could be wrong and they have ventured into a new area of repairing and rebuilds. An earlier post mentioned Unit 11 and Cath Burrows both of whom are in the North-West - both very good and Unit 11 is probably the go-to guy for air-cooled Porsche and Cath is certainly very good across the range.
 
  
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deMort
Dijon


Joined: 21 Mar 2015
Posts: 7477
Location: Brighton


PostPosted: Mon Jun 03, 2019 7:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

My garage has done rather a lot of gearbox rebuilds on all models so i'll just throw it in there as a consideration .


https://www.precisionporsche.co.uk/
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AP90
Nürburgring


Joined: 25 Sep 2004
Posts: 387
Location: Cornwall UK


PostPosted: Tue Jun 04, 2019 7:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

cheshire911 wrote:
AP90 wrote:
Hi Jan

Try Williams Crawford in Saltash, just over the Devon border in Cornwall

They do a lot of renovation work

https://www.williamscrawford.co.uk

They're not particularly cheap tho'


Do they actually do the job or outsource it someone else? I was always under the impression they use other people in the renovation and are more caretaking and over-seeing the job rather than rolling their sleeves up and doing it themselves. But I could be wrong and they have ventured into a new area of repairing and rebuilds. An earlier post mentioned Unit 11 and Cath Burrows both of whom are in the North-West - both very good and Unit 11 is probably the go-to guy for air-cooled Porsche and Cath is certainly very good across the range.


You may be right about that, I was at an open day there recently and there were a lot of stripped down engines and gearboxes there. I think that if you have a chat with Richard Williams, you'd get a straight answer, what I have noticed is a large proportion of their new warehouse is dedicated to sales, not unlike JZM who have also gone in that direction. However they do have a restoration section so I would imagine they have quite a lot of expertise on site
 
  
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pietrzj
Spa-Francorchamps


Joined: 19 Mar 2014
Posts: 274



PostPosted: Tue Jun 04, 2019 8:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks to those who have replied so far. I have sent off for estimates from a number of specialists and popped in to chat to my local. Now learning some new words like "Lash", and inspecting my old photos of the drain plug magnet to determine the shape and patena of the filings and shards found the first time I changed my gear oil about 3 years ago!! Thankfully there was hardly any filings in there when I changed the oil again a month or so ago and I think those are purely due to the crunching into second.

Some feedback has suggested I might have a worn diff as well as the synchro going on the first to second gear. Strange thing on that last issue is that it only does it on the first or first and second gearchange on a journey from cold. Which is like the oil hasn't been thrown around enough or something weird as once its warm there is no problem. I have tried two different oils of the recomended viscocity and its not as if the South coast of England gets very cold - so that is an odd one. Mind you now I am typing this I have thought that if its something like a heat problem, maybe somethings expanding when it warms up and the problem goes away as a result. That sounds more likely than the oil type as why wouldn't all gears have the same problem when cold?

here are a few photos to keep you interested. The shards are from the last 3 years driving.
 



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pietrzj
Spa-Francorchamps


Joined: 19 Mar 2014
Posts: 274



PostPosted: Tue Jun 04, 2019 8:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

another...
 



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pietrzj
Spa-Francorchamps


Joined: 19 Mar 2014
Posts: 274



PostPosted: Tue Jun 04, 2019 8:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

and the third...
 



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pietrzj
Spa-Francorchamps


Joined: 19 Mar 2014
Posts: 274



PostPosted: Tue Jun 04, 2019 8:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

This one is on the sump plug when I first got the car and did a gear oil change (Thankfully the second oil change was much healthier in comparison).
 



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deMort
Dijon


Joined: 21 Mar 2015
Posts: 7477
Location: Brighton


PostPosted: Tue Jun 04, 2019 8:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

If the metal is bronze in colour which it appears to be then its parts of a synchro ring .

In this case i would assume 2nd gear .

From your earlier comments and you may well have diff bearing play .
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.

My Daughter's Crowdfunding has hit the target .

Thank you all so Very much .

She's not going until july 2020 though .



Mechanic

7pm - 9pm

Now At An Indy.
 
  
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Cameltoe & Heel
Barcelona


Joined: 26 Jan 2009
Posts: 1343
Location: Preston - Lancs


PostPosted: Wed Jun 05, 2019 7:50 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think that would be typical for the mileage you're looking at...those metal bits likely to be from your syncros

My car certainly suffered from a lack of transmission oil change.

The condition of your syncro's between gears will vary, mine required new 3rd and 4th, there's various bearings that will need replacing including your diff bearings. I needed new planetary gears in the diff too and mine were munched, so a full diff set was ordered, I supplied a new diff housing too.

An example of what you may require in there, obviously every box is different.

Syncros
Needle Rollers (diff)
Diff bearings
Diff bolts
Angular bearing
roller bearing
Gasket set
Pinnion bearing
Cone rings
rings
Various sockets, roll pins, washers, nuts, caps and seals

Trev
 
  
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JonMit
Newbie


Joined: 05 Nov 2012
Posts: 17
Location: Bournemouth


PostPosted: Thu Jun 06, 2019 4:42 pm    Post subject: Re: Gearbox rebuilder in South or South West? Reply with quote

pietrzj wrote:
Hi,
My closest Porsche specialists are JMG Porsche in Bornemouth and Canford Classics, but would like at least 4 to contact.

Any suggestions?

Jan


Hi Jan,

Just for the archives, I think I will put in here what my advice was.

Mainly being there are a number of ways that people will call a transmission rebuild, ranging from....

* The domestic transmission specialists, who will often just take the gearbox apart, find the problem, replace the offending part, with potentially little regard for setting the gearbox up as it goes back together, as they are often working to domestic basic transport car expectations. Every town has a transmission specialist workshop working to these expectations.

* Then there is the Porsche way, to the book and by the official manuals (including what is covered in the earlier factory manuals that are assumed have been digested), this should see you with a good transmission if they go through the whole procedures, methods and good practices.

* My way is far too expensive (to be brutally honest), as it involves assembling and disassembling the transmission over and over again, checking mesh patterns and measuring preloads and lash, which as I say, is complete overkill, but does result in a silky smooth gear selection, silence and increased load resilience, difficult to quantify or justify, which is why I recommend us sending transmissions to someone who does it all day every day such as....

* Then there are the transmission specialists who really care, know their stuff, work on high end transmissions every day. These people because it is an every day thing for them, they work on impeccable instincts of how a shaft turns and the feel, to cut down on my methods, but get the same kind of results. In the past I have removed customers transmissions, who have sent them to places like Sports and Classic for rebuilds, we have installed them again and everything has been great.
If it were my baby (as my time to me is free) I would rebuild my transmission, but if it were less of a lifetime keeper, or if I had to pay for my own labour and the severe amount of time involved with my method, I would send them to Sports and Classic.

Then there are all the independent Porsche specialists, some of whom might tell you they have rebuilt it, but it may have gone to somewhere else.. Then there are some who are varying shades of proficiency, some might be better than Sports and Classic.

But for me, unless its a rare transmission and it is money no object, it is the only job where I recommend people do not use us, just based on cost, my OCD for transmissions are too expensive.. unless they don't mind it being removed, shipped to Sports and Classic or elsewhere, and then re-installed by us. But the rebuilder has to be paid by the customer, and the warranty between the customer and the rebuilder.

This is the only area, apart from body repairs, that I turn down work.

However for the sake of this post, the photos would indicate it is a transmission issue, not gear oil selection (Swepco can make gears bulk during gear selection for example) or anything simple, this one does need a repair or really a complete rebuild.
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pietrzj
Spa-Francorchamps


Joined: 19 Mar 2014
Posts: 274



PostPosted: Mon Jun 10, 2019 4:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks all. I am making progress and will keep you all posted.
 
  
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pietrzj
Spa-Francorchamps


Joined: 19 Mar 2014
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 12, 2019 9:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thank you Jon, a very comprehensive response, I will let you know what I decide. Regards, Jan
 
  
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