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Geezer 911
Trainee


Joined: 14 Aug 2017
Posts: 77
Location: Essex Boy


PostPosted: Sat Mar 30, 2019 7:35 am    Post subject: Get out of Gen 2 Carrea for Turbo? Reply with quote

Morning guys,

I am in my 2nd year of 911 ownership (black gen Carrera 2 S PDk) and I have loved every minute of it.

The car has is my daily - driving to train station and is an all weekender.

I am having thought s about trading in for a Gen 2 Turbo PDK. Although this would be an amazing upgrade is it really worth getting out of a Carrera S for the type of driving I do? I be honest the car has not been tracked, there is not enough road in the my local area for this car to benefit its current capabilities apart from a couple nice B roads and short stretch of the M11 where there are no cameras...

The price jump for a turbo is obviously huge!Keen to hear some constructive thoughts.
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MisterCorn
Dijon


Joined: 08 Jan 2011
Posts: 7070
Location: Nottingham, England

2004 Porsche 996 Turbo

PostPosted: Sat Mar 30, 2019 7:41 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

If you don't get to use the acceleration a reasonabke amount of the time I would be tempted to stick with the Carrera. The throttle response will be better in the Carrera.

MC
 
  
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Norfolk & Idea
Albert Park


Joined: 15 Jan 2016
Posts: 1537
Location: South Yorkshire


PostPosted: Sat Mar 30, 2019 7:48 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Constructive thoughts eh?

Tick that box. Get a turbo, they're fekkin mental fast! You can always switch back if it doesn't work for you. And you won't take a bath thumbsup

If the man maths works, do it Wink
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nigel99
Barcelona


Joined: 16 Jul 2015
Posts: 1313
Location: Berkshire

2009 Porsche 997 Carrera 2S

PostPosted: Sat Mar 30, 2019 7:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I've had exactly the same thoughts recently but decided to stick with my C2s for a while longer.

The cost to change worked out between £25-30k and I couldn't justify that for a car that would be almost identical when I sat in it and doesn't sound as good (imo) when the engine was running.

Obviously the turbo is unbelievably quick but I can't recall many occasions when I thought the C2s wasn't fast enough.

The turbo itch is still there and will be scratched as some point but not at the current pricing because I don't see it as value for money at this stage.
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MisterCorn
Dijon


Joined: 08 Jan 2011
Posts: 7070
Location: Nottingham, England

2004 Porsche 996 Turbo

PostPosted: Sat Mar 30, 2019 8:01 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Some more detailled thoughts from me...

I drive both a C2 and a turbo, but 996 rather than 997. For the vast majority of driving the C2 has enough power and the power can be used. It is easier to get a nice flowing driving style in the C2. With the turbo it is so mentally quick that you are only on the throttle for a second at a time (I checked my data logging from a reasonably spirited drive a couple of years ago and the longest on full throttle was 0.9s). On most roads you are constantly at the limit of the speed you feel is acceptable and spend next to no time accelerating. Speed is constantly being kept in check. With the turbo, from 30mph to 100mph it can just be left in third and gives mind bending performance, at least in the Carrera you get to change gears every now and then to get the best out of it.
That said, when you want it, the acceleration on the turbo is like no other and deeply addictive, that is why mine is away now for more power upgrades Smile . Just don't think of it as a car for a sensible morning blast.

MC
 
  
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James M-S
Suzuka


Joined: 11 Apr 2017
Posts: 1012
Location: Derbyshire

2009 Porsche 997 Carrera 2

PostPosted: Sat Mar 30, 2019 8:25 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I love the NA power delivery from 3500-6000rpm. Grin

I would find upgrading to GT3 much more tempting (and easier to keep my license!)

If I had that kind of spare cash for car fund I would add a caterham to the fleet (but I’ve got nice twisties near me) Thumb
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Counter Of Beans
Spa-Francorchamps


Joined: 10 May 2018
Posts: 301
Location: Hampshire


PostPosted: Sat Mar 30, 2019 9:12 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I agree with your thoughts nigel99; the cost to change from my Carrera to a nice gen 2 Turbo, or even Turbo S would be around £35 - 40k, and that is a lot of money for a car that would be identical on the inside, wouldn't sound as good, might cost more to maintain, and is heavier and wider than my C2.

I wouldn't drive it any faster 99% of the time, because here (Portsmouth / Southampton area) you're constrained by speed humps, congestion and "safety" cameras (LOL).

Ah, but then again, there's the impressive shove of acceleration from the Turbo, and it's.......well it's the Turbo, isn't it? You know, one of Porsche's top models and all that.

If it holds its value then, yes, it's capital tied up but much more fun than cash in a savings account, plus you only live once...........

Damn you, Geezer911,; just when I thought I'd resolved to be sensible! Hand
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Geezer 911
Trainee


Joined: 14 Aug 2017
Posts: 77
Location: Essex Boy


PostPosted: Sat Mar 30, 2019 9:26 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks very much for the immediate responses. There is already a balanced argument to keep or buy. Looks like I need to do a test drive.. my Carrera in sports plus mode is super fast already I am genuinely curious to see the responsiveness in acceleration that the turbo has.
 
  
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T8
General
General


Joined: 29 Jun 2010
Posts: 15652
Location: Kent


PostPosted: Sat Mar 30, 2019 9:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

It sounds like you've got an itch you'll just have to scratch Geezer'. Smile

Perhaps I can offer a cost effective solution.

Firstly, let me make it clear that I fully appreciate that the PDK box that you are used to is far superior to the earlier Tiptronic. No argument, it's a fact BUT in the turbo it's far less relevant than in a Carrera.

So, if you could live with a slightly older model, my suggestion is that a Gen1 997T would satisfy your craving without a major investment. There's a lot of good Gen1 Tip' cars out there for under £55k.

For daily use you wouldn't notice any difference but at weekends you'd quickly understand why those that have owned a turbo find it difficult to change back.

Any frustration that you find in not being able to fully exploit the performance of your Carrera will undoubtedly be magnified but on the occasions that you can 'let rip' you'll be fully rewarded. Be warned though that the temptation to venture further afield - possibly involving a Channel crossing - might become irresistible. You might also find yourself seeking out a runway event or two.

Finally, just to clarify. I'm not suggesting that the Gen1 car necessarily offers any better value for money than the Gen2 car but the cost to get in to one is significantly lower.

Good Luck Thumb
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ex 2002 Seal Grey 996.2 C4 Tiptronic
ex 1978 Silver 924 Manual
 
  
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T8
General
General


Joined: 29 Jun 2010
Posts: 15652
Location: Kent


PostPosted: Sat Mar 30, 2019 9:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Geezer 911 wrote:


Thanks very much for the immediate responses. There is already a balanced argument to keep or buy. Looks like I need to do a test drive.. my Carrera in sports plus mode is super fast already I am genuinely curious to see the responsiveness in acceleration that the turbo has.



Don't take a test drive unless you've got the finances in place to do the deal straight after. Very Happy

If you're able to test the turbo properly the surge from 2k to 5k will be enough to convert you, especially if you're in 'M' mode and in Sport. Under normal driving circumstances I'd wager you'd be just as impressed with the low down torque of the car.
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ex 2002 Seal Grey 996.2 C4 Tiptronic
ex 1978 Silver 924 Manual
 
  
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Ishay
Monza


Joined: 28 Aug 2015
Posts: 230



PostPosted: Sat Mar 30, 2019 12:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Having done it I would never ever (ever) go back. I wouldn’t daily mine because it’s manual and the PDK was definitely better for commuting, but as I’ve said before the only way up from here is the GT2 for me, even the GT3 holds no desire and the Carrera is now barely an afterthought (no offence intended).

It’s not just the the thrill of the torque. When on a motorway it also means effortless acceleration into an outer lane.

That said mine’s not a daily and it is difficult to keep to a speed (without cruise control) because it is so effortless
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easternjets
Watkins Glen


Joined: 29 Apr 2016
Posts: 2032
Location: Darlington


PostPosted: Sat Mar 30, 2019 2:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The mid range torque in a Turbo is really special, you can talk about power outputs but it's that mid range grunt that sets them apart and in Sport mode it's incredible.
The only down side is the sound is muted due to the turbo's but I put a straight thru pipe on and it restored a bit of the growl that you'd expect.
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911TEL
Albert Park


Joined: 29 Oct 2007
Posts: 1509
Location: Inverness & Kazakhstan

2011 Porsche 997 Turbo S

PostPosted: Sun Mar 31, 2019 1:55 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I would say that IF you test drive it , be ready for the explosion of man maths that will take over your every waking thought....

There is something iconic about 'The turbo' that grips a potential owner...… once in it and driven it , it becomes a bit of a strange relationship with your car ….

Its a bit muted by the nature of the turbocharged effect on the noise that is evident on the N/A car - 'easternjets' has mention the required mod to the exhaust can be carried out .. I fitted a Kline to mine which is probably somewhere in between …..

What will affect you is the Turbo Rush.... the change of velocity that N/A drivers are not party to ……
You probably will not really master the control of it on your test drive , that control comes later after a few close calls almost running up the 4r5e of the vehicle in front as you try to make progress past them.....

And... there is the sound …

...the sound of a Jet Fighter shaped vehicle punching a 911 shaped hole through the space in front ….. The Quantum Leap of a moving object transposing itself into a projectile , no longer just a car ………...

ok so a bit dramatic … but its the best description I can use ...because that's what it is like …..

Get your cash ready ….. you drive it , you will be buying it ….

Grin Grin
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msaif996
Trainee


Joined: 08 Dec 2010
Posts: 79
Location: 997.1 Turbo Conv. 6MT


PostPosted: Sun Mar 31, 2019 3:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Same as MisterCorn above, I’ve got a 996C23.6 6MT and a 997.1TT 6MT. C2 more usable but Turbo is also fine at lower rpms. Turbo stirs your soul and is a supercar, more of an occasion each time you drive it. Looks stunning. If I had to choose it would be the Turbo, it’s leagues ahead of anything else I’ve driven.
Objectively and subjectively it’s the better car. Looks wise it’s the more aggressive looking car. The power is intoxicating. Like you, I don’t track my cars. In actual fact, I drive each one probably twice a year now as I work abroad but when I do it’s the Turbo that I get most excited about.
Test drive and you’ll see for yourself. Good luck with whatever you decide, it’s one of the better dilemmas to have.
 
  
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Robertb
Dijon


Joined: 01 Sep 2003
Posts: 7110
Location: South Oxfordshire

2002 Porsche 996 Carrera 4S

PostPosted: Sun Mar 31, 2019 8:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

911Tel has sold it for me. I didn’t realise I wanted a turbo til now Sad
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FRP
Albert Park


Joined: 30 Apr 2014
Posts: 1638
Location: Middlesex


PostPosted: Sun Mar 31, 2019 10:30 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Turbo all day but it am biased. Get yer cash ready. Test drive it. Buy it. Modify it. Don’t look back .... simples.
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MisterCorn
Dijon


Joined: 08 Jan 2011
Posts: 7070
Location: Nottingham, England

2004 Porsche 996 Turbo

PostPosted: Sun Mar 31, 2019 10:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

FRP wrote:
Turbo all day but it am biased. Get yer cash ready. Test drive it. Buy it. Modify it. Don’t look back .... simples.


I do like the ability to modify the turbo, it is pretty much endless depending on how deep your pockets and how long your arms are. Unfortunately for somebody with an addictive personality and little self control like me it isn't always a good thing. Bloody good fun though. I have had mine for over 8 years, the longest I have ever owned a car. No plans to ever sell it.

MC
 
  
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Bikeracer1098
Suzuka


Joined: 28 Mar 2015
Posts: 1042
Location: Camberley, Surrey


PostPosted: Sun Mar 31, 2019 4:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Geezer 911 wrote:
Thanks very much for the immediate responses. There is already a balanced argument to keep or buy. Looks like I need to do a test drive.. my Carrera in sports plus mode is super fast already I am genuinely curious to see the responsiveness in acceleration that the turbo has.


Get yourself a test drive and then decide.
I’m sure you will be blown away by the Performance.
Can’t understand anyone saying that the std Carrera’s are quick, Maybee I’ve spent too many years riding Superbikes.
However a new Golf R, Focus RS etc are as quick or quicker than a Carrera.

Also when these cars were new, the price difference between a Carrera/2S etc and a turbo was huge. Probably close to £40k
Also the turbo will always retain its value.

Best of luck 👍
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MisterCorn
Dijon


Joined: 08 Jan 2011
Posts: 7070
Location: Nottingham, England

2004 Porsche 996 Turbo

PostPosted: Sun Mar 31, 2019 5:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

It is the not quickness which is the appeal of the Carrera. The idea of changing gear and driving through the gears, holding the speed through the corners to get the best out of it. There is no right answer on which one to own. Neither one ticks all boxes.

MC
 
  
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MaxA
Albert Park


Joined: 11 Oct 2015
Posts: 1538
Location: Helsinki


PostPosted: Mon Apr 01, 2019 3:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

If you're the kind of bloke who is even thinking about a Turbo, then you should be in a Turbo. A 997.1 makes a lot of sense in terms of cost to switch.

You might need to upgrade the brakes though, according to the chaps on another thread.
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