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S444Will
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Joined: 17 Dec 2015
Posts: 15



PostPosted: Mon Feb 25, 2019 2:24 pm    Post subject: 997.1 C4S to 997.1 Turbo tiptronic? Reply with quote

This question has probably been asked hundreds of times but here goes. I’ve owned a pretty mint 997.1 4S for the last 3.5 years and I’m getting itchy feet for a turbo. The issue I’ve potentially got is to buy a well spec’d car in the right condition I’m probably looking at a tiptronic. I need to go have a drive but am I going to miss the driver focus of a manual or does the tip suit the turbo’s nature?
Most of my driving is on country A and B roads with bits of motorway thrown in too, not a great deal of city driving.
I realise this is very much a case of first world problems but HELP!!

Cheers
Will
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T8
General
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Joined: 29 Jun 2010
Posts: 15176
Location: Kent


PostPosted: Mon Feb 25, 2019 2:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The torque of the Turbo means that it is better suited to a Tiptronic or PDK box than any other sports Porsche.

If you're planning on sticking with the best colour I know where there's a really nice one for sale. Smile

See --> http://911uk.com/viewtopic.php?t=129529&start=0&postdays=0&postorder=asc&highlight=
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2007 Guards Red 997 Turbo Tiptronic
ex 2004 Polar Silver 996T Tiptronic
ex 2002 Seal Grey 996.2 C4 Tiptronic
ex 1978 Silver 924 Manual
 
  
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S444Will
Newbie


Joined: 17 Dec 2015
Posts: 15



PostPosted: Mon Feb 25, 2019 2:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hmm I could almost get that past the fiancé without her even realising it was a different car!
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HSC911
Long Beach


Joined: 23 Jul 2014
Posts: 6288
Location: Bedford


PostPosted: Mon Feb 25, 2019 2:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Grin

Do it Thumb
 
  
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apollokre1d
Sepang


Joined: 06 Nov 2012
Posts: 2872
Location: United Kingdom


PostPosted: Mon Feb 25, 2019 3:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

If you have a manual now I would drive test drive the tip before making the decision to switch.

I had a C4S with a manual and switched to a turbo with a manual because I found the tip gearbox (in non-turbo car that I drove) not be anywhere near as good... but that was my experience and yours could well be different Smile
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New997buyer
Fuji


Joined: 17 Oct 2010
Posts: 9140



PostPosted: Mon Feb 25, 2019 3:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I’m in the unusual position of having owned both. In real world driving I can’t see why you’d select the manual over the tip. So I’d recommend a tip turbo rather than pay the premium for a manual. The tip is faster in a straight line too as it gets off the line easier. It can also change gear in auto at WOT. Good luck doing that in a manual.

But as ever try both and ignore the proper driver stuff. Unless you’re Jason Plato I doubt it’ll make much difference. Beyond pub car park bragging rights thumbsup

Good luck and enjoy your search. There’s a lovely red one that’s mint on sale here. Very diligent owner too Very Happy
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apollokre1d
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Joined: 06 Nov 2012
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Location: United Kingdom


PostPosted: Mon Feb 25, 2019 3:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

OP asked if he would miss the driving focus and listed A and B roads as being part of his daily commute... not launching his car off the line and taking part at VMAX Smile
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S444Will
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Joined: 17 Dec 2015
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 25, 2019 3:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

You guys are pretty much confirming what I suspected would be the case and I need to get myself some time in the drivers seat of a tiptronic.
For those of you who have or do own a tiptronic, when you’re on a spirited drive do you find yourself shifting gears yourself or leaving the car in auto?
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T8
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Joined: 29 Jun 2010
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 25, 2019 3:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

S444Will wrote:


For those of you who have or do own a tiptronic, when you’re on a spirited drive do you find yourself shifting gears yourself or leaving the car in auto?



That's the joy of Tip' driving. You can decide on the day. Smile

Personally I prefer to engage 'Sports' mode, put it in 'D' and concentrate on just steering the thing. After a very short time the gearbox learns that you're pushing on and hangs on to the gears for just as long as you would if you were in 'M'.

I made reference to the torque before. It's that which brings about the biggest difference in driving a turbo rather than a Carrera. Carreras thrive on revs. Turbos use their low down grunt and are looking to offer another slug of it far lower down the rev range. It's almost like driving a diesel but one that's got a rocket up its' arris. Very Happy
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ex 2004 Polar Silver 996T Tiptronic
ex 2002 Seal Grey 996.2 C4 Tiptronic
ex 1978 Silver 924 Manual
 
  
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T8
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 25, 2019 4:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Once upon a time, a long time ago, I penned a thread about driving a Tiptronic at spirited speeds.

At the time I had a 996C4 but the gist of the story is still relevant. In fact I'd argue that, given the extra speed at which you'd be travelling, it's even more relevant in a Turbo scenario.

See what you think.

--> http://911uk.com/viewtopic.php?t=78825&start=0&postdays=0&postorder=asc&highlight=spirited
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ex 2004 Polar Silver 996T Tiptronic
ex 2002 Seal Grey 996.2 C4 Tiptronic
ex 1978 Silver 924 Manual
 
  
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FZP
Paul Ricard


Joined: 18 Jan 2015
Posts: 3121
Location: Cheshire


PostPosted: Mon Feb 25, 2019 5:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

So I feel like I saw this car this morning in the B&Q car park near Wilmslow get to g a coffee from Costa. Any chance it was you OP?
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S444Will
Newbie


Joined: 17 Dec 2015
Posts: 15



PostPosted: Mon Feb 25, 2019 5:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

No not me, she hasn’t moved today. I’m based in Yorkshire so not a million miles away but not me on this occasion.
I didn’t realise how common red 997s were Very Happy
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FZP
Paul Ricard


Joined: 18 Jan 2015
Posts: 3121
Location: Cheshire


PostPosted: Mon Feb 25, 2019 6:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

S444Will wrote:
No not me, she hasn’t moved today. I’m based in Yorkshire so not a million miles away but not me on this occasion.
I didn’t realise how common red 997s were Very Happy

Well I just lost the house as there is an identical Guards Red 4S with those wheels in black. The one I saw today had a tan interior, don't tell me it's a proper doppelganger with the trifecta of features
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New997buyer
Fuji


Joined: 17 Oct 2010
Posts: 9140



PostPosted: Mon Feb 25, 2019 7:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

apollokre1d wrote:
OP asked if he would miss the driving focus and listed A and B roads as being part of his daily commute... not launching his car off the line and taking part at VMAX Smile


Apologies I thought it was implicit. Let me be more explicit Wink

I drove my tips (first a 996 turbo then a 997 turbo) on everything from the Millbrook proving ground to the Notth Coast 500 via Autobahns, the Alps and the Ballons des Vosges. And lots of A, B and even C roads in between. I never found either lacked driver focus. And now I’m in a manual it doesn’t feel more driver focused.

On A roads the tip changed down fluidly and eagerly and if not it could be managed manually. On sweeping B roads you’re essentially using 3rd and 4th gear most of the time. The same in a recent hoon back from Center Gravity in my manual.

As for daily commute I used to do 42 miles each way from Harrow to Cranfield and back again. On a commute when traffic gets blocked as it often does in the UK a tip makes life much easier. Especially spotting gaps in slow moving traffic and being able to point and squirt.

Finally a tip allows you to not focus on up changes when joining traffic on motorways or dual carriageways. Whereas in the manual you need to be mindful of the changes from 2nd to 3rd being needed quicker than you might realise.

Don’t get me wrong a tip wasn’t perfect. But if you want driver focused forget the gearbox and focus instead on getting it to Center Gravity.

But that’s just my opinion. Others are available. Including your own, OP. Try both and decide for yourself thumbsup
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“Try not to become a man of success. Rather become a man of value.” Albert Einstein

Present - 997.1 turbo man
Past - 997.1 turbo tip S, 996.2 turbo tip S, 996.1 C2 man

Last edited by New997buyer on Mon Feb 25, 2019 7:49 pm; edited 2 times in total
 
  
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ragpicker
Estoril


Joined: 14 Apr 2013
Posts: 3914
Location: North East England


PostPosted: Mon Feb 25, 2019 7:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

New997buyer wrote:
apollokre1d wrote:
OP asked if he would miss the driving focus and listed A and B roads as being part of his daily commute... not launching his car off the line and taking part at VMAX Smile


Apologies I thought it was implicit. Let me be more explicit Wink

I drove my tips (first a 996 turbo then a 997 turbo) on everything from the Millbrook proving ground to the Notth Coast 500 via Autobahns, the Alps and the Ballons des Vosges. And lots of A, B and even C roads in between. I never found either lacked driver focus. And now I’m in a manual it doesn’t feel more driver focused.

On A roads the tip changed down fluidly and eagerly and if not it could be managed manually. On sweeping B roads you’re essentially using 3rd and 4th gear most of the time. The same in a recent boom back from Center Gravity in my manual.

As for daily commute I used to do 42 miles each way from Harrow to Cranfield and back again. On a commute when traffic gets blocked as it often does in the UK a tip makes life much easier. Especially spotting gaps in slow moving traffic and being able to point and squirt.

Finally a tip allows you to not focus on up chnages when joining traffic on motorways or dual carriageways. Whereas in the manual you need to be mindful of the changes from 2nd to 3rd being needed quicker than you might realise.

Don’t get me wrong a tip wasn’t perfect. But if you want driver focused forget the gearbox and focus instead on getting it to Center Gravity.

But that’s just my opinion. Others are available. Including your own, OP. Try both and decide for yourself thumbsup


Very much my thoughts. I've never sat in my turbo and thought 'ohhhh I wish I had a manual one instead..'. Absolutely never.

The turbo suits the tip box. Neither Man nor Tip is right or wrong though, just decide yourself. Thumb
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S444Will
Newbie


Joined: 17 Dec 2015
Posts: 15



PostPosted: Mon Feb 25, 2019 9:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

FZP wrote:
S444Will wrote:
No not me, she hasn’t moved today. I’m based in Yorkshire so not a million miles away but not me on this occasion.
I didn’t realise how common red 997s were Very Happy

Well I just lost the house as there is an identical Guards Red 4S with those wheels in black. The one I saw today had a tan interior, don't tell me it's a proper doppelganger with the trifecta of features


No it’s not quite identical then, mines got dark grey interior. I did go check in the garage just to make sure it was still there!! Question yep still there Very Happy
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S444Will
Newbie


Joined: 17 Dec 2015
Posts: 15



PostPosted: Mon Feb 25, 2019 9:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks for all of the replies. You guys have just confirmed what I already knew really, I’m sure there isn’t such a thing as a bad choice just the correct choice for each person. I need to drive one then make a decision.
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S444Will
Newbie


Joined: 17 Dec 2015
Posts: 15



PostPosted: Tue Feb 26, 2019 6:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

T8 wrote:
The torque of the Turbo means that it is better suited to a Tiptronic or PDK box than any other sports Porsche.

If you're planning on sticking with the best colour I know where there's a really nice one for sale. Smile

See --> http://911uk.com/viewtopic.php?t=129529&start=0&postdays=0&postorder=asc&highlight=


I keep finding myself going back to have a look at the advert for your turbo, it looks like a cracking example and I like the fact it’s under an opc warranty until 2020.
In the service history it mentions that it’s had a new gearbox at 50500 and then 59000 miles, what was the issue with the gearbox? From everything I read the tip box is almost bulletproof.

Cheers
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kas750
Reims


Joined: 31 Mar 2013
Posts: 4363
Location: Chorley lancashire

2006 Porsche 911

PostPosted: Tue Feb 26, 2019 6:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have had two Tiptronic cars and
I’ve never felt I needed a manual.
I’ve said it before but a tiptronic car driven on the buttons would leave the equivalent engined car with a manual box for dead on a twisty road unless your name is Walter Rohrl.
 
  
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ragpicker
Estoril


Joined: 14 Apr 2013
Posts: 3914
Location: North East England


PostPosted: Tue Feb 26, 2019 6:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I believe Terry's car had leaky transfer box gaskets. Its the only real issue with the tip box. They can be repaired in situ by an knowledgeable Indy for a few hundred quid but as OPC don't touch the boxes as they are a Merc part they just replace the whole unit at a cost of £12k or so.

The transfer gaskets tend to fail if the gearbox mount is worn. This places stress on the joint where the transfer box meets the gearbox (usually around the dowel). If the mount is not replaced the new gaskets can end up failing again.

I know this as my car (996 turbo ) has the same gearbox and I've been through something similar a couple of times.

Of course, having an OPC warranty until 2020 means you don't have to worry about such problems.

Terry's car is fabulous in the metal too. Superb example and fastidious owner Thumb
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