Time to move on?

Basalt911 · 12 Feb 2019

Hi

One time forum member, long time lurker, I thought it time to seek counsel

After 6 years, I'm thinking of getting rid of my 997.1

The car is great and in really good order, but I only do 3k miles a year (currently 92k) as I use run-about (Mini Cooper D) for day to day and commuting. The special days are still special, but they seem few and far between. Plus my annual Le Mans trip will soon need to be accompanied by my 2 sons...

Bills have been ok, and there are none of the warning signs of impending doom. Even though my car as all the 'preventative measures' installed, I always fear 'the big one'. Whilst I could probably afford a re-build, it would be really sickening on a car worth circa £20k.

I'm thinking of chopping it (and the run about) in and getting a £30k M2/M3/M4 or even (whisper it) a Golf R and then using it every day.

I guess others have been in the same boat and decided one way or another. Really interested in hearing how others have rationalised it.

cheers,
Dave

BChivs · 12 Feb 2019

Basalt911 said:
Hi

One time forum member, long time lurker, I thought it time to seek counsel

After 6 years, I'm thinking of getting rid of my 997.1

The car is great and in really good order, but I only do 3k miles a year (currently 92k) as I use run-about (Mini Cooper D) for day to day and commuting. The special days are still special, but they seem few and far between. Plus my annual Le Mans trip will soon need to be accompanied by my 2 sons...

Bills have been ok, and there are none of the warning signs of impending doom. Even though my car as all the 'preventative measures' installed, I always fear 'the big one'. Whilst I could probably afford a re-build, it would be really sickening on a car worth circa £20k.

I'm thinking of chopping it (and the run about) in and getting a £30k M2/M3/M4 or even (whisper it) a Golf R and then using it every day.

I guess others have been in the same boat and decided one way or another. Really interested in hearing how others have rationalised it.

cheers,
Dave

Tough call but I can relate to this.....I had my last Porsche for only a brief spell. I loved the car but I was one of the unlucky ones. I have been looking to replace it since but seems unless spending almost double there is little that is grabbing me. I have found myself looking back at fast BMW's. I know on this Porsche forum they receive bad press, but they have always been great all round cars for me. Cheapish to run, comfy enough to bomb down to the south of France, don't stand out in Tesco but also catch eyes at a breakfast meet and have better rear seats for my little boy with proper isofix. I test drove an M2 and was blown away. Felt much bigger inside and proper quick....you also have more affordable tuning potential...a DMS remap will see 420ish BHP. I am currently swaying towards a Valencia 1M Coupe due to stronger residuals, but if future value was of no consideration I would be driving home an M2 Competition Manual tomorrow.

Slayer · 12 Feb 2019

I have moved on to Golf R and A45 AMG after owning a few Porkers.

Golf R is an understated good every day car. Get the right spec , you won't regret. Some may find it boring with the 4WD due to lack of being tail happy!.
If you are into remap etc, it could a bit more lively.

Not terribly expensive to maintain either.

Phil 997 · 12 Feb 2019

As BChivs says there are a number of options if and its a big IF a fast soulless euro box will give you those special big grin days. if all you want is licence losing straight line speed then there are a number of Audis and BMWs that are very fast . but they will not make that drive at event and special.
I see them flying past me every day taking risks overtaking and the reason for this is simply all you can do is go fast other than that they are totally soulless bland boxes.
As you say your 997 may only be worth 20k ish as it is but should it go bang and need a rebuild it will be worth 27/29k so most of the cost recouped . as you say the 997 has cost you virtually nothing for the past 6 years and probably hasn't cost you must in depreciation in that time. why are you worried even if a rebuild was needed I bet its the cheapest overall annual motoring you have had in your driving life. I am for keeping it , it doesn't owe you a penny its holding its value and its fantastic fun to drive . ok one a year for a couple of days you may need something bigger for your sons ,so hire something for a few hundred quid , rather than give up your fun weekend toy.

ultimately its your call but I have had many fast BMWs over the years they are just not a patch on the fun of driving a 911.
hope some of my post gives you some food for thought. :thumb:

Basalt911 · 12 Feb 2019

Phil 997 said:
As you say your 997 may only be worth 20k ish as it is but should it go bang and need a rebuild it will be worth 27/29k so most of the cost recouped . as you say the 997 has cost you virtually nothing for the past 6 years and probably hasn't cost you must in depreciation in that time. why are you worried even if a rebuild was needed I bet its the cheapest overall annual motoring you have had in your driving life. I am for keeping it , it doesn't owe you a penny its holding its value and its fantastic fun to drive :thumb:

all of this is true, and a very convincing argument...my last Merc and BMW halved in value over less than 3 years...I paid £26k at a respected Indy for my 911 in 2012 and reckon it's worth £22k ish now...

(notice you're in Bournemouth Phil...I'm in Ringwood)

Phil 997 · 12 Feb 2019

Basalt911 said:
Phil 997 said:

As you say your 997 may only be worth 20k ish as it is but should it go bang and need a rebuild it will be worth 27/29k so most of the cost recouped . as you say the 997 has cost you virtually nothing for the past 6 years and probably hasn't cost you must in depreciation in that time. why are you worried even if a rebuild was needed I bet its the cheapest overall annual motoring you have had in your driving life. I am for keeping it , it doesn't owe you a penny its holding its value and its fantastic fun to drive :thumb:

Click to expand...

all of this is true, and a very convincing argument...my last Merc and BMW halved in value over less than 3 years...I paid £26k at a respected Indy for my 911 in 2012 and reckon it's worth £22k ish now...

(notice you're in Bournemouth Phil...I'm in Ringwood)

Blimey mate I am in Ferndown . Theres quite a few members around this area. 6.5 years and its cost you 4k in depreciation and very little in running cost . why on earth do you want to sell it. Seems your biggest worry is borescore , spend a couple of hundred quid and get it scoped that would tell you if its a keeper . 92k if its got the older IMS, at that milage the commonly accepted view is if was going to go it would have by now . If you need the number of a time served mobile Porsche tech who can scope it and check it over let me know . :thumb:

TonyC911 · 12 Feb 2019

This is a really tricky one! Likewise, I am getting close to having to make a similar decision. Prices on the Gen 1's are continuing to fall (albeit very gradual), so it's probably a case of keeping it forever and trying to forget about the money tied-up in it, just enjoying it (as much as possible).

I am still heavily invested in the Porsche brand and especially the 911. Whilst I really like the Gen 2's I am having a tough time justifying the upgrade costs for such a similar car, albeit with stronger residuals.

At this moment, I am leaning towards selling next year and getting a 991, which should be easily doable at around £40-£45k privately. However, my mind could change next week! :?

BChivs · 12 Feb 2019

Phil 997 said:
As BChivs says there are a number of options if and its a big IF a fast soulless euro box will give you those special big grin days. if all you want is licence losing straight line speed then there are a number of Audis and BMWs that are very fast . but they will not make that drive at event and special.
I see them flying past me every day taking risks overtaking and the reason for this is simply all you can do is go fast other than that they are totally soulless bland boxes.
As you say your 997 may only be worth 20k ish as it is but should it go bang and need a rebuild it will be worth 27/29k so most of the cost recouped . as you say the 997 has cost you virtually nothing for the past 6 years and probably hasn't cost you must in depreciation in that time. why are you worried even if a rebuild was needed I bet its the cheapest overall annual motoring you have had in your driving life. I am for keeping it , it doesn't owe you a penny its holding its value and its fantastic fun to drive . ok one a year for a couple of days you may need something bigger for your sons ,so hire something for a few hundred quid , rather than give up your fun weekend toy.

ultimately its your call but I have had many fast BMWs over the years they are just not a patch on the fun of driving a 911.
hope some of my post gives you some food for thought. :thumb:

I agree to an extent, especially with regard to residuals....you would be mad to get into a new M car...the New M5 is £100k plus yet I have seen 6 month old examples for circa £70k!!!! Mental if you can afford to chuck away £30-40k in 6months.

I think though if your careful what you go for there values are strong. E.g a low mileage E93 M3 Comp pack, E46 CSL, 1M, Z3M/Z4M and even early M2's around the £30k figure are all safe places to put your money and will retain solid.
I not going to totally disagree with the Porsche v BMW character arguement....I loved the drama of my C4S....backing that fat noisey ass out of the garage always made me grin, but I don't think you can say all BM's and Merc's are soulless. The M3 CSL is a legend in its own right, and the 1M is following in its footsteps hailed by every journalist as a perfect little setup and a pure drivers car.
I have tried desperately to want a 997.2 C2S having driven 2 now, but couldn't get excited about them....just left me feeling a bit flat. For me for I'd need that little extra such as a 996/997 turbo which for good examples are more than I can justify for the little use it will receive.

Then there is the image....I paid £26k for my Porsche and everyone thought I'd won the lottery and I actually heard of ***** that made snide remarks about where I'd got the money from and I was probably on the take! It was only £26k!
If I went and spent £40k odd on a 1M nobody would even comment on its value and would just compliment. Funny old world we live in!

James M-S · 12 Feb 2019

Why not enjoy the 911 every day on the commute?

How big are your kids? In my opinion the 911 is the perfect three-seater. (I'm 6'4"). My tall 9&11 yr olds fit fine.

Thought about a 997.2 if you fear a big bill, or a Panamera?

Don't want to shatter your dreams but I think you'll struggle to get £20k for yours, especially at this time of year.

I'm tempted by 2014 M5's for when my kids don't fit in the 911. 25-30% of original list price!

Or what about swap the mini for a golf gti (for daily/family fun), and swap the 911 for a cayman/Boxster/Elise/caterham (for solo fun/high days&holidays) Elise or caterham unlikely to depreciate. That would fit your total budget?

hermes · 13 Feb 2019

What to do....

I found myself in this position. 70,000 miles on my C4S, and just a hint of something not right with the lump at the back. I had hoped to use the car as a stepping stone to a 996/997 GT3.

In the end I sent the car to Hartech, and there is wear consistent with the mileage, which would reasonably command a heavily discounted sale price (if someone did a borescope). So, sell at a big discount, or fix it and keep it.

I decided to fix mine, and keep it. Spending the GT3 budget on nice bits instead (OEM bucket seats, suspension refresh for example).

rabbitstew · 13 Feb 2019

James M-S said:
Why not enjoy the 911 every day on the commute?

How big are your kids? In my opinion the 911 is the perfect three-seater. (I'm 6'4"). My tall 9&11 yr olds fit fine.

Thats exactly what I do. I couldnt justify having the 911 just as a weekend car as with a wife & 2 kids I dont get time at the weekends to enjoy any of my toys, and so I just use my car as a daily driver. I do 14,000 miles a year in it and every single drive is a special event, even now. Whether that's driving for 7 hours when I went to Newcastle & back in a day, or just driving 4 miles to the local train station then leaving it in the car park all day.

The cars subtle enough that people dont even notice it, unless you know what it is! It also makes me smile dropping the kids off at school when all the other parents are driving big Range Rover sized trucks.

hermes · 13 Feb 2019

What to do....

I should have said, my C4S is also my daily driver. About a 1000 miles a month.

easternjets · 13 Feb 2019

It must be the time of year, I've been looking to change out of the Porsche and into another car, dare I say it an AMG Merc!
After much haggling and 'sleeping on it's' I decided against it, for the moment at least. Main reason was I need 4 seats, only very occasionally but a strict two seater just seemed impractical, I have an SUV but I use it all the time so you do want a bit of a change on sunny days.
I've got to admit to being a bit of a sucker for shiny new cars, especially when they're loaded like the Merc and the sound!
They are epic but Merc are struggling to sell them and TBH I think I've only seen two on the road, so whilst they are rareish I was worried about the ability to sell it on.
So for now my turbo is still in the garage and the Merc is still in the showroom!

Roro · 13 Feb 2019

M2 is a great car. I'm very happy with mine, perfect daily and partner to the GT3. Nothing bad to say about it, but perhaps because I still have my GT3 which has all the sports car qualities that the M2 doesn't. Not sure I'd feel the same about the M2 if it was my only car... Compared to the GT3 the steering is numb and the manual gear change is more or less fine (typical BMW mush), but again that's partly why the M2 is a great daily. It's a bit more insulated but sporty, and has a nice turn of speed and excitement when needed, and looks amazing in my view. Haven't taken it on track yet, but I expect it to be good fun albeit rather remote-feeling compared to the GT3

Rincewind · 13 Feb 2019

I am also in the daily driver camp, albeit with a 996.2. I came out of a company car scheme when I changed jobs, I was in a 330d MSport + Touring which was great for a commute and lugging stuff around.

I contemplated another quick BMW, Golf R etc. but finally decided on the 996. My kids being a bit older (9 and 13) was actually one of the reasons for going down the 996 route. They both fit in the back really easily, when I tried a few years ago my sons legs poked into the back of the front seats as they weren't long enough to get his knees past the edge of the seat.

There is enough space for the four of us, the small dog and a few bags for a weekend away (again easier than when they were smaller and you needed to take more stuff).

It now does the daily commute with me and my son to school, with a bike on the roof for the last bit of my commute and occasionally a harp in the back with the seats down!! The roof rack means I can even get some wood on the roof for DIY. Super practical and I always enjoy the journey. Even scarily managed to get the fuel range indicator to register 457 miles on a fresh tank on a recent trip to Manchester (I think the 50mph roadworks for miles on the M6 helped) - not sure I will ever see that again!

As an aside discovered that the wife's mini Clubman was more practical for getting luggage to the airport than the 3 series touring.

If that wasn't clear - a vote for sticking with the 997!!

Time to move on?

Basalt911

Trainee

BChivs

Spa-Francorchamps

Slayer

Estoril

Phil 997

Le Mans

Basalt911

Trainee

Phil 997

Le Mans

TonyC911

Barcelona

BChivs

Spa-Francorchamps

James M-S

Barcelona

hermes

Spa-Francorchamps

rabbitstew

Imola

hermes

Spa-Francorchamps

easternjets

Paul Ricard

Roro

Sebring

Rincewind

New member

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