Buying advice please....

HomersSpiceRack · 4 Nov 2017

Morning All,

I have popped in from the 993 forum as I fancy a 997 and was hoping for a few pointers. I am probably looking at a late Gen 1 car budget wise, tiptronic and not to bothered about C2 or C4.

I hope that didn't sound as if I know anything about 997s, as I don't, and happy to be swayed.

I am going to have a stroll around the forum but can anyone point me in the direction of some good online buying guides?

Thanks

Endex · 4 Nov 2017

There's a long one on Hartech's website but not sure it majors on 997. My advice would be buy on provenance and condition and if you can find one that has been future proofed through engine rebuild by a reputable company then that would be better in the long term.

Having bought a 997.1 C4S, I find the suspension firm for UK roads and after a few months of ownership I'm pretty confident I would have survived perfectly well with a C2/4 though for some reason they seem to be fewer in number than C2/4S.

Mine is manual as it is not my daily and I run it alongside an M2 DCT which is my everyday thrasher. The manual/ tiptronic debate rages on with regularity but it's down to what you want to use the car for and driving style/ preference.

Phil997 will be along soon to provide far more detailed advice but buy carefully, get pre purchase inspection and be prepared to be open on specification and you will have little difficulty in owning a great car.

Good luck with the search.

Phil 997 · 4 Nov 2017

Morning,
In brief the 3.6 gen1 is widely accepted as having the stronger engine , But the 3.8 is a fantastic engine and the horror stories about borescoring and IMS are a worry but they are not as prevalent as the internet would have you believe and borescore is in relatively small numbers of cars having said that you dont want to be one of the few so its imperative you get a ppi and borescope done. The IMS will not be an issue to you as your buying a late gen1 and anything post march 06 had the up rated bearings.
If you want total piece of mind then you might be better looking for a hartech rebuild engined car as generally Hartech will have rebuilt the engine so its better than factory.

a C2/S will usually be a little cheaper than the C4/S
The non S rides a bit higher and has volcano interior trim not galvarno silver which the S has and has the black dials not the white/silver on the S.

The tip box is a nice box not as sophisticated as the PDK but still a nice unit.
the one thing that happens is the tip is adaptive and will learn your driving style so lots of slow traffic driving and it gets a lazy style this can be reset by a quick kick down but it soon returns to lazy . I went a long way to overcoming this by fitting a sprint booster as it kept the car more alert .

any questions you have feel free to ask :thumb: :thumb:

T8 · 4 Nov 2017

HomersSpiceRack said:
I am going to have a stroll around the forum but can anyone point me in the direction of some good online buying guides?

I suspect that by now you've had a good scroll down the 997 sub-forum and FAQs so you'll have had most of your questions answered including dozens that you didn't know you needed to ask. :grin:

Knowing your actual budget would help but the general advice when buying a Gen1 car is to buy as late a car as you can as having the latest IMS bearing is beneficial. The 3.8'S' cars, and especially Tiptronics, are most prone to the other major potential issue, bore-scoring.

A sensible mileage, 57/08, 3.6 with a decent spec will offer fantastic value for money as a first venture into the darkside.

Happy Hunting. :thumbs:

HomersSpiceRack · 4 Nov 2017

Some good pointers from you guy's straight away thanks.

Phil, appreciate the March '06 steer.

Prob. should have said that I am going for an S and definitely a coupe.

I also will get a tip. I am keeping the 993 for blatting and this is going to be a motorway queen.

I think I probably have to do a little more reading to get me up to speed on the model.

Also someone said you have to put water in them :? Is that just a rumour

tom_nieto · 4 Nov 2017

Your budget would be really useful as if you can stretch there's no reason to buy a pre facelift car. The gen 2's sat nav is almost worth the extra cash on its own! The PDK box is meant to be a quantum leap over the tiptronic. If it's just a motorway and leisurely driving car I really wouldn't be worried about the extra horsepower of the S (or the harder suspension) and would instead concentrate on buying one based on having the correct creature comforts (i.e. one that looks pretty!).

If it's definitely a gen 1, then the updated IMS, regular oil changes and a pre purchase inspection with bore scope would be things to look out for. I wouldn't rule out a good early car if its had either a rebuild or a replacement IMS. You might also save some cash by taking a well cared for higher mileage car, especially if you plan to get out and use it.

Happy hunting!

Phil 997 · 4 Nov 2017

HomersSpiceRack said:
Some good pointers from you guy's straight away thanks.

Also someone said you have to put water in them :? Is that just a rumour

:floor: :floor: :floor: And its considered unsafe to drive them wearing sandals and socks , apparently the wearing of facial hair is acceptable provided its neat and trimmed . :grin: :grin: good luck in the search keep us posted :thumb:

resigner · 4 Nov 2017

Cheapest Gen 2 4S I can see on PH is this one at £43k. Prices have without a doubt risen in the past 6 months and haven't softened for the winter.

If it's going to be a motorway queen, why do you want an auto? Do you sit in traffic a lot on said motorway?

if so, I would say a non S Gen 2 car which you get for mid thirty £k's would be perfect.

Why 4 wheel drive?

Even a Gen 1 car, in 4S form, will set you back around £30k, so I would suggest trying a 2S. They are really quite different drives. Some people like the 4, personally I like the 2S, felt lighter and more nimble to me, purer I would say, but each to their own!

Take a few out, get a good one, if you can find a Hartech rebuilt car, that would be great, but don't discount others. Gen 1's do have problems, but nowhere near as much as the doom mongering Gen 2 owners will have you believe! Bore Score, IMS on pre 2006 cars, thats about it really. Tyres all round will set you back £800 or so. New discs and pads about £1200. New clutch and flywheel about £1500, so get any car checked out.

Last thing, PCM2.1 is useless, the sat nav is a joke, but you can change the unit for a few hundred pounds and get everything an up to date stereo should be doing!

Wonderful cars, one of the best looking 911's I would have to say.

But we seem to be complete opposites as I have a Manual C2S Cabrio

Phil 997 · 4 Nov 2017

Some good advice from resigner. take a look at the 2S having had both 2WD and AWD the 2S is a more nimble light feeling car, but the 4S in corners and the wet is fantastic . they are both quite different beasts so worth trying both to decide really what it is you want from your motorway queen. The clutch on the manual can be quite heavy especially compared to other marques . Unless you really feel the need for a manual stick with your plan of an auto , and thats advise from someone with a manual :grin: :grin:

TonyC911 · 4 Nov 2017

You might find this useful... I love a good car guide!

https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B074WD6RR9/

There are plenty of over-priced private sales out there, don't be fooled by sellers trying to re-coup the premiums they paid to trade specialists. I always use Glass's Guide for pricing before buying any car.

Good luck with your search, look forward to hearing more on your purchase!

Endex · 4 Nov 2017

HomersSpiceRack said:
Some good pointers from you guy's straight away thanks.

Phil, appreciate the March '06 steer.

Prob. should have said that I am going for an S and definitely a coupe.

I also will get a tip. I am keeping the 993 for blatting and this is going to be a motorway queen.

I think I probably have to do a little more reading to get me up to speed on the model.

Also someone said you have to put water in them :? Is that just a rumour

My car is Nov 2005 and has the later IMS bearing as I checked through this forum - I'll dig out the details but it is not month but after a certain engine number.

Found it! For 3.8 engines you will be hoping the engine number is 0168509791 or later.
_________________

seeforez · 4 Nov 2017

yes as others say buy a decent one with history and invest in a PPI and your ready to go....

resigner · 4 Nov 2017

Test drive more than one as well!

i took 6 out, only 1 4S though as I instantly knew it wasn't for me.

Is resale a concern? Would have to say a manual is a better long term bet money wise. You can already see a manual GTS is probably the zenith for 'normal' 997s.

Clutches can be heavy, but I was told it probably needs replacing if that's the case.

I would say get a car which already has some miles, like 60k plus, if you are going to add a load. Also, a Gen 2 non S is allegedly the same speed wise as an S Gen 1, so something like this would be a good bet:

https://www.pistonheads.com/classif...carrera-997/porsche-911-carrera-2-pdk/7499331

PDK is great, Tiptronic horrid (sorry Phil!), manual lovely but yeah, in traffic, a pain. I work at home, so mine isn't ever in traffic really..... Also love a proper manual. Wifes M240i has an auto DCT box thingy, hate the way I can't get it to have the power ready the exact instant I want it coming off a roundabout.......

pcat · 4 Nov 2017

Gen 2
Manual
RWD
S
PSE
H&S bypass

A future classic, as long as you keep the water topped up

Phil 997 · 4 Nov 2017

Endex said:
HomersSpiceRack said:

Some good pointers from you guy's straight away thanks.

Phil, appreciate the March '06 steer.

Prob. should have said that I am going for an S and definitely a coupe.

I also will get a tip. I am keeping the 993 for blatting and this is going to be a motorway queen.

I think I probably have to do a little more reading to get me up to speed on the model.

Also someone said you have to put water in them :? Is that just a rumour

Click to expand...

My car is Nov 2005 and has the later IMS bearing as I checked through this forum - I'll dig out the details but it is not month but after a certain engine number.

Found it! For 3.8 engines you will be hoping the engine number is 0168509791 or later.
_________________

Yes just to clarify this point, all post march 06 cars had the newer IMS bearing some late 05 and early 06 cars had the newer bearing . here is the definitive guide with engine numbers etc. so you can be 100% sure if you do end up looking at earlier gen1 cars.

Last IMS revision before no IMS (Gen2 MA1 block):

997 Carrera 3.6 with engine numbers from M96/0569507475 are the new IMS design.

M96/05 = 997 3.6 Carrera NA
6 = 6 cylinders
9 = design revision
5 = year (2005)
07475 = cumulative production serial

This means some MY2005 benefit and all MY2006 onwards benefit.

997 Carrera S 3.8 with engine numbers from M97/0168509790 are the new IMS design.

M97/01 = 997 3.8 Carrera NA
6 = 6 cylinders
8 = design revision
5 = year (2005)
09790 = cumulative production serial

This means some MY2005 benefit and all MY2006 onwards benefit.

Buying advice please....

HomersSpiceRack

New member

Endex

Monza

Phil 997

Le Mans

T8

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HomersSpiceRack

New member

tom_nieto

Montreal

Phil 997

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resigner

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Phil 997

Le Mans

TonyC911

Barcelona

Endex

Monza

seeforez

Barcelona

resigner

Barcelona

pcat

Spa-Francorchamps

Phil 997

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