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Scholester
Montreal


Joined: 16 Jan 2012
Posts: 616
Location: South West


PostPosted: Sat Jul 29, 2017 10:17 pm    Post subject: Tandem pump cover swap - minor detail Reply with quote

I am still working on my car (work has been extremely busy) and part of my list of bits is a new Tandem Pump Cover.
The existing cover was in fact in pretty good order with only minor/moderate rusting but being swapped out it is for one of the excellent quality ACP covers (not over-cover).
The question is, when I removed my old cover, the blade and two end bearings slipped out with it. I get how it sits together and it may be a little tricky in ensuring that the new cover slips over the blade/bearings without them shifting (I was thinking elastic band until cover is partially on before sniping this away).
The actual question is whether there is any significance of the tiny little slot on one side of the blade as the other side is marked with a blue circle. Does this micro-slot engage with anything within the slotted pump shaft?
I will try and upload some photos which may help explain a whole lot better. Photos may follow as not uploading in this post.
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Scholester
Montreal


Joined: 16 Jan 2012
Posts: 616
Location: South West


PostPosted: Sat Jul 29, 2017 10:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Second time lucky?
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Scholester
Montreal


Joined: 16 Jan 2012
Posts: 616
Location: South West


PostPosted: Sat Jul 29, 2017 10:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

New cover
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symoonbeam
Monza


Joined: 02 Jun 2014
Posts: 212
Location: French France


PostPosted: Sun Jul 30, 2017 7:28 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Scholester
FYI - you might find that you have an issue following fitting of the ACP cover with getting any vacuum generated.

I purchased one of these covers and had it fitted at 9e - although the cover was well made, there was no vacuum following its fitment. Re-fitting the original cover solved the problem.

Apparently this is a common problem.

I gather it is more to do with the way the original vanes and covers have bedded together, rather than an issue with the replacement cover itself - if the new cover does not provide any vacuum the only options are to either refit the original cover or replace the entire pump.
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Scholester
Montreal


Joined: 16 Jan 2012
Posts: 616
Location: South West


PostPosted: Mon Jul 31, 2017 12:00 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

symoonbeam wrote:
Scholester
FYI - you might find that you have an issue following fitting of the ACP cover with getting any vacuum generated.

I purchased one of these covers and had it fitted at 9e - although the cover was well made, there was no vacuum following its fitment. Re-fitting the original cover solved the problem.

Apparently this is a common problem.

I gather it is more to do with the way the original vanes and covers have bedded together, rather than an issue with the replacement cover itself - if the new cover does not provide any vacuum the only options are to either refit the original cover or replace the entire pump.

Thanks for this Sy.

Not being a particularly technical bod', how will this manifest itself in what I will notice/ what will not happen, that should happen!? Excuse my ignorance but I have never taken the trouble to understand what the pump actually does!

Any more contributors on the specific orientation of the blade itself with blue circle v small slotted grove?
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symoonbeam
Monza


Joined: 02 Jun 2014
Posts: 212
Location: French France


PostPosted: Mon Jul 31, 2017 9:35 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The tandem pump provides vacuum pressure to assist the brake and (I think) clutch circuits so you will find that you have a very hard brake pedal and that it doesn't actually apply the brakes to any degree!!
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Scholester
Montreal


Joined: 16 Jan 2012
Posts: 616
Location: South West


PostPosted: Mon Jul 31, 2017 5:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

symoonbeam wrote:
The tandem pump provides vacuum pressure to assist the brake and (I think) clutch circuits so you will find that you have a very hard brake pedal and that it doesn't actually apply the brakes to any degree!!

Quite important to get this right then!

Any views on the small slot on one side of the blade that holds the two outer bearings?
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Demort
Paul Ricard


Joined: 21 Mar 2015
Posts: 3115
Location: Sussex


PostPosted: Mon Jul 31, 2017 7:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Im the first to admit ive never removed a cover from one of these .. ive always just changed the unit ..

Are you sure that part in the cover doesnt fit in the pump side as there are no locations for it in the cover and it REALLY looks to me like its part of the pump ..

Picture of the pump side if posible please .
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Scholester
Montreal


Joined: 16 Jan 2012
Posts: 616
Location: South West


PostPosted: Tue Aug 01, 2017 12:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Demort wrote:
Im the first to admit ive never removed a cover from one of these .. ive always just changed the unit ..

Are you sure that part in the cover doesnt fit in the pump side as there are no locations for it in the cover and it REALLY looks to me like its part of the pump ..

Picture of the pump side if posible please .

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Scholester
Montreal


Joined: 16 Jan 2012
Posts: 616
Location: South West


PostPosted: Tue Aug 01, 2017 12:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yes Demort, locates on the pump side then the cover slips over. Will be fun keeping the three items together whist pushing the cover in place but a rubber band may help initially before fully pushing the cover home.
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Demort
Paul Ricard


Joined: 21 Mar 2015
Posts: 3115
Location: Sussex


PostPosted: Tue Aug 01, 2017 7:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Excellent .. thanks for that as ive never seen the inside of one before .

Probably teaching you to suck eggs here as you are doing what i havent but if you turn the engine over by hand would the pump bars end up sideways and stay in place a little easier to get the cover on Dont know

I promise that the next time i change one ill strip it and see how it all works .. ill know what im talking about then Smile
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Scholester
Montreal


Joined: 16 Jan 2012
Posts: 616
Location: South West


PostPosted: Tue Aug 01, 2017 8:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Demort wrote:
Excellent .. thanks for that as ive never seen the inside of one before .

Probably teaching you to suck eggs here as you are doing what i havent but if you turn the engine over by hand would the pump bars end up sideways and stay in place a little easier to get the cover on Dont know

I promise that the next time i change one ill strip it and see how it all works .. ill know what im talking about then Smile

Thanks again Demort.

I am good friends with The Finn on here and he changed his cover with little problem and did not experience any of the issues that Sy has raised with not getting a vacumm.

The fitting itself is not the problem, it was really whether the oriapentation of the little slot on the blade made any difference but I think it's down to me to experiment further.

Thumb
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Stever845
Silverstone


Joined: 10 Aug 2016
Posts: 149
Location: Oxfordshire

2005 Porsche 997 Carrera 2S

PostPosted: Tue Aug 01, 2017 9:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I put one of these on mine about a 1000 miles ago with no issues so far .

http://911uk.com/viewtopic.php?t=119488&start=0&postdays=0&postorder=asc&highlight=
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Scholester
Montreal


Joined: 16 Jan 2012
Posts: 616
Location: South West


PostPosted: Wed Aug 02, 2017 4:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Stever845 wrote:
I put one of these on mine about a 1000 miles ago with no issues so far .

http://911uk.com/viewtopic.php?t=119488&start=0&postdays=0&postorder=asc&highlight=


That is good news. Hopefully mine too will work swimmingly.

I reckon another couple of shifts in the garage (may not be until late August) will see all of the work done and I will complete a little write up on what I achieved as I have taken many photos for reference.

Thanks all Thumb
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Nik
Imola


Joined: 03 Apr 2007
Posts: 777
Location: Surrey


PostPosted: Sun Aug 06, 2017 4:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sorry for the ignorant question but is this tandem pump cover an issue for 997.1 as well as 997.2 ?

Also, the ACP cover seems a little pricey at £175?
 
  
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Scholester
Montreal


Joined: 16 Jan 2012
Posts: 616
Location: South West


PostPosted: Tue Aug 08, 2017 6:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Nik wrote:
Sorry for the ignorant question but is this tandem pump cover an issue for 997.1 as well as 997.2 ?

Also, the ACP cover seems a little pricey at £175?


Hi Nik,
In all honesty, I am not sure what set-up the DFI engine (.2) has with regards to the Pump. I can however tell you that .1 and .1T both have the Pierburg pump with poor quality cover that will rust through in time and should be monitored often and closely. Original replacement Pierburg covers are not available so it's either a new pump or something like this ACP option which is half the price of a new pump.
Regards,
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systech1
Newbie


Joined: 10 Jul 2016
Posts: 30
Location: Adelaide, South Australia


PostPosted: Tue Aug 08, 2017 7:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

symoonbeam wrote:
The tandem pump provides vacuum pressure to assist the brake and (I think) clutch circuits so you will find that you have a very hard brake pedal and that it doesn't actually apply the brakes to any degree!!


Also provides vacuum for the hemholz resonator in the airbox and PSE switchover (if you have this option).
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DucatiRob
Suzuka


Joined: 22 Jul 2015
Posts: 1182
Location: Milton Keynes

2006 Porsche 997 Carrera 2S

PostPosted: Tue Aug 08, 2017 8:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Scholester wrote:
Nik wrote:
Sorry for the ignorant question but is this tandem pump cover an issue for 997.1 as well as 997.2 ?

Also, the ACP cover seems a little pricey at £175?


Hi Nik,
In all honesty, I am not sure what set-up the DFI engine (.2) has with regards to the Pump. I can however tell you that .1 and .1T both have the Pierburg pump with poor quality cover that will rust through in time and should be monitored often and closely. Original replacement Pierburg covers are not available so it's either a new pump or something like this ACP option which is half the price of a new pump.
Regards,


Worth noting that Autodoc sell the Pierburg pump at much less than Porsche, around £250, they are always having sales too, this week it was 17% off everything!!

I read a lot about the various covers available for the standard pump and there are very mixed reports, some ok and some not. The cover itself is a bearing surface for the blade, so any inaccuracy here is going to be a problem, particularly as the internals will have bedded in and worn to the old cover!
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Nik
Imola


Joined: 03 Apr 2007
Posts: 777
Location: Surrey


PostPosted: Tue Aug 08, 2017 4:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Scholester wrote:

Hi Nik,
In all honesty, I am not sure what set-up the DFI engine (.2) has with regards to the Pump. I can however tell you that .1 and .1T both have the Pierburg pump with poor quality cover that will rust through in time and should be monitored often and closely. Original replacement Pierburg covers are not available so it's either a new pump or something like this ACP option which is half the price of a new pump.
Regards,


Many thanks. Will do some more digging to see if I have the same on the 997.2.

I was just thinking that £175 is a lost for a cover, when the new pump can be bought for £230 as mentioned above.
 
  
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Scholester
Montreal


Joined: 16 Jan 2012
Posts: 616
Location: South West


PostPosted: Wed Aug 09, 2017 2:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

DucatiRob wrote:
Scholester wrote:
Nik wrote:
Sorry for the ignorant question but is this tandem pump cover an issue for 997.1 as well as 997.2 ?

Also, the ACP cover seems a little pricey at £175?


Hi Nik,
In all honesty, I am not sure what set-up the DFI engine (.2) has with regards to the Pump. I can however tell you that .1 and .1T both have the Pierburg pump with poor quality cover that will rust through in time and should be monitored often and closely. Original replacement Pierburg covers are not available so it's either a new pump or something like this ACP option which is half the price of a new pump.
Regards,


Worth noting that Autodoc sell the Pierburg pump at much less than Porsche, around £250, they are always having sales too, this week it was 17% off everything!!

I read a lot about the various covers available for the standard pump and there are very mixed reports, some ok and some not. The cover itself is a bearing surface for the blade, so any inaccuracy here is going to be a problem, particularly as the internals will have bedded in and worn to the old cover!

The original cover looks like a cheap pressed piece of mild steel to me so not sure that the milled ACP cover can offer less in the way of tolerances. The ACP comes with QC certification so here's hoping!
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