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jotaking
Spa-Francorchamps


Joined: 01 Jun 2012
Posts: 325



PostPosted: Tue Jun 20, 2017 12:00 pm    Post subject: Explanation Required Reply with quote

Just been watching a youtube video of 997 T vs GT3 at the Nurbergring.


Open Youtube Page


I was quite surprised at how the "stock" turbo on "street tyres" brushed off the GT3 contingent?

My hypotheses are: -

1. 997 Turbo driver is Lewis Hamilton
2. GT3 drivers aren't pushing hard and are willing to back off to let T through?
3. 997 T is not stock and not on street tyres?

I know that the T has a HP advantage, however, I thought all the aero, weight saving and "cat-like" agility of the GT3 would have left the T standing on the twisty stuff??

**Edit for youtube linky - Thanks to Apollokreid for the "geek tip" Very Happy

Last edited by jotaking on Tue Jun 20, 2017 4:58 pm; edited 3 times in total
 
  
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Pip1968
Suzuka


Joined: 26 Oct 2009
Posts: 1060
Location: Blighty


PostPosted: Tue Jun 20, 2017 12:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

It is difficult to comment on the video as You Tube says it does not exist. Maybe it has been pulled or there has been some error in uploading.

Maybe Porsche have asked for it to be pulled Very Happy Very Happy .

The bottom line is unless it is a controlled environment the Nordschleife is such that you should not be surprized to see a Mini passing a Porsche. Different drivers, modifications, weather, Touristfahrt or closed track day and busy or quiet on track all have an effect on who comes first.

Not everyone wants to risk their pride and joy and Porsche are not as common place on 'the Ring' as they used to be.

Pip
 
  
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apollokre1d
Indianapolis


Joined: 06 Nov 2012
Posts: 2318
Location: United Kingdom


PostPosted: Tue Jun 20, 2017 12:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi, that link does not work for me, has it been removed?
 
  
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apollokre1d
Indianapolis


Joined: 06 Nov 2012
Posts: 2318
Location: United Kingdom


PostPosted: Tue Jun 20, 2017 12:36 pm    Post subject: Re: Explanation Required Reply with quote

I think I have it....


Open Youtube Page


Here is another, a stock 997 turbo is still a good track car in the hands of a good driver (which I am not).


Open Youtube Page
 
  
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ragpicker
Paul Ricard


Joined: 14 Apr 2013
Posts: 3092
Location: North East England


PostPosted: Tue Jun 20, 2017 12:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yeah, track days are not a good indicator of how good a car is when you look at videos. The only real way to tell is to have the same driver test the different cars and time them to compare.

The difference between a very good driver and a good driver is massive. Many track day enthusiasts are good drivers, but put someone behind the wheel who really knows how to pilot a car and its amazing.

I remember when I was getting instruction for my ARDS licence, the tutor was an ex Formula 3 world champion. That was the day I realised I will never be in what I would class as the 'very good' category.
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986 S - usually in pieces: http://911uk.com/viewtopic.php?t=112626
 
  
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jotaking
Spa-Francorchamps


Joined: 01 Jun 2012
Posts: 325



PostPosted: Tue Jun 20, 2017 1:08 pm    Post subject: Re: Explanation Required Reply with quote

apollokre1d wrote:
I think I have it....


Open Youtube Page




That's the one....thanks for that.

I used the youtube tags with the full url? I don't think the forum likes that??

Back to the vid...

I agree, some of the GT3's look like they are cruising, however there is one towards the end of the vid (7.03) where it looks to be driven in anger and yet the T strolls past it?
 
  
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apollokre1d
Indianapolis


Joined: 06 Nov 2012
Posts: 2318
Location: United Kingdom


PostPosted: Tue Jun 20, 2017 1:19 pm    Post subject: Re: Explanation Required Reply with quote

jotaking wrote:
That's the one....thanks for that.

I used the youtube tags with the full url? I don't think the forum likes that??


Pleasure Smile

You don't need the full URL just the last 11 characters after the "=" sign.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5OIO0vPUWTo
 
  
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Diggermeister
Spa-Francorchamps


Joined: 26 May 2015
Posts: 274



PostPosted: Tue Jun 20, 2017 4:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Nothing wrong with the way a turbo handles on the track, and they have a lot of power too. Granted, there's probably more skill and art (possibly more fun too) to pedalling a GT3 around faster, but a turbo is, by no means, the lardy disappointment on track it's general reputation would suggest.

As others say here, there's also variations in skill and stupidity of the pilots too. Plus, for all any of us know, the 991 GT3 might have been 'showing' his mate in the 997 GT3 around - the former being more experienced and the latter trying to learn the lines from him. We don't know.
 
  
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mm450exc
Trainee


Joined: 13 Jun 2009
Posts: 80



PostPosted: Tue Jun 20, 2017 11:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

It's obvious they were not driving.

This is what a proper GT3 lap looks like.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Uqa8MFSXZHM
 
  
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jotaking
Spa-Francorchamps


Joined: 01 Jun 2012
Posts: 325



PostPosted: Thu Jun 22, 2017 2:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Think I have found another video from the same "turbo" driver Surprised

https://drivetribe.com/gallery/JoiT5iPVS5mePYkUQdlQqg?iid=DBX4AaLeT9SAEz2SSa6Jqw
 
  
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FZP
Imola


Joined: 18 Jan 2015
Posts: 872
Location: Cheshire


PostPosted: Thu Jun 22, 2017 5:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The turbo isn't standard in my book....far from it. To be able to launch past GT3S like that would require 700bhp+.
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Senoj
Zolder


Joined: 23 Jan 2006
Posts: 5009
Location: Sussex


PostPosted: Thu Jun 22, 2017 7:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

mm450exc wrote:
It's obvious they were not driving.



This ^^

Even the turbo wasn't that quick..8.25 ish BTG. Lots of traffic certainly but top speeds at some of the fastest sections were pretty normal. The great thing about turbocharged 911 at TF is you have so much grunt getting that getting back up to a decent lick after being baulked by traffic is a lot easier than in the nasp gt3.
 
  
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Frenchmeister
Suzuka


Joined: 24 Feb 2014
Posts: 1076
Location: Beautiful Cumbria.

2004 Porsche 997 Carrera 2S

PostPosted: Thu Jun 22, 2017 10:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The car did not sound standard.
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jotaking
Spa-Francorchamps


Joined: 01 Jun 2012
Posts: 325



PostPosted: Fri Jul 14, 2017 1:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Not in English, however worth a watch with the caption translate tool.

GT3 104.62
997 T 104.95


Open Youtube Page
 
  
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Norfolk & Idea
Österreich


Joined: 15 Jan 2016
Posts: 939
Location: South Yorkshire


PostPosted: Fri Jul 14, 2017 2:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The explanation to op is very simple. The 911 turbo is a massively capable car and it will take a skilled pilot in a GT3 to see one off. And of course, the driver is a massive ingredient to the equation.
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