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DucatiRob
Suzuka


Joined: 22 Jul 2015
Posts: 1231
Location: Milton Keynes

2006 Porsche 997 Carrera 2S

PostPosted: Sun Apr 30, 2017 11:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I guess oil usage is so variable depending on lots of things, driving style, engine condition, journey lengths, ambient conditions etc.

My Gen1 used very little oil until the last 3 - 4 months before my engine rebuild when consumption rose significantly, although it was still probably well within the Porsche limits! It also never really smoked except the very occasional puff on start up! The problem is, when you are aware of a problem or think there might be something wrong, it is natural to be over conscious of every little anomaly. I think I became so hyper sensitive I was imagining all sorts of noises, vibrations etc. Until it was driving me mad!
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DRZ911
Suzuka


Joined: 13 Mar 2013
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 30, 2017 12:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

DucatiRob wrote:
I guess oil usage is so variable depending on lots of things, driving style, engine condition, journey lengths, ambient conditions etc.

My Gen1 used very little oil until the last 3 - 4 months before my engine rebuild when consumption rose significantly, although it was still probably well within the Porsche limits! It also never really smoked except the very occasional puff on start up! The problem is, when you are aware of a problem or think there might be something wrong, it is natural to be over conscious of every little anomaly. I think I became so hyper sensitive I was imagining all sorts of noises, vibrations etc. Until it was driving me mad!


DucatiRob - many congratulations on your 1000th post. Very Happy Very Happy
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DucatiRob
Suzuka


Joined: 22 Jul 2015
Posts: 1231
Location: Milton Keynes

2006 Porsche 997 Carrera 2S

PostPosted: Sun Apr 30, 2017 1:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

DRZ911 wrote:
DucatiRob wrote:
I guess oil usage is so variable depending on lots of things, driving style, engine condition, journey lengths, ambient conditions etc.

My Gen1 used very little oil until the last 3 - 4 months before my engine rebuild when consumption rose significantly, although it was still probably well within the Porsche limits! It also never really smoked except the very occasional puff on start up! The problem is, when you are aware of a problem or think there might be something wrong, it is natural to be over conscious of every little anomaly. I think I became so hyper sensitive I was imagining all sorts of noises, vibrations etc. Until it was driving me mad!


DucatiRob - many congratulations on your 1000th post. Very Happy Very Happy


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glenwells
Silverstone


Joined: 20 Aug 2015
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 30, 2017 4:38 pm    Post subject: previous 911's Reply with quote

I have had 911's before and they only used a little oil between services - never needed topping up 4K oil changes.

I cannot get my head around 1L per 620 miles.
May seem strange but part of me hopes they do find a problem eg AOS or whatever. Don't think I can keep a car long term that uses so much oil.
I do wonder if taking it to a Porsche main dealer is the wisest move as they may have a vested interest in saying it is fine - reputation of 997.2 engines etc.

Reality is that the oil is being used somewhere somehow it is not evaporating and it is in all likelihood via poor tolerances, piston rings, or valves or a combination.

My last 911 a 996.2 C2 used a little oil but when I changed the oil type it was negligible between changes.

Porsche stats of 1L per 633 miles being acceptable just does not wash with me at all. Don't care what people try and convince me of. Engines will all consume 'some' by design the pistons need lubing but it cannot be good long term to be chewing through that amount. I have seen my father take apart many an engine with problems to see first hand what long term oil deposits look like.

Will see what Porsche Exeter say - it is not their own warranty so will know in a couple of weeks.
I will strongly dispute it if they say it is not using that amount as I have been monitoring it since December and used a measuring jug to refill and kept a spreadsheet.

Ta for the comments and info
Glen
 
  
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seeforez
Barcelona


Joined: 10 Jan 2016
Posts: 1476
Location: up norf


PostPosted: Sun Apr 30, 2017 5:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

good luck mate hope it is just a seal or AOS etc that can be quickly fixed, i think your right i wouldn't be happy using that much oil so make sure its not an option just to give it back and say its within tolerance when you drop it off!
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Demort
Estoril


Joined: 21 Mar 2015
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Location: Sussex


PostPosted: Sun Apr 30, 2017 6:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Oil usage imho is different from car to car .. ive seen great variations for no real reason .

Gen 2 997 has a different oil seperator and whilst it can fail its more unlikely .. you tend to get vacum type noises when it does fail .

An OPC .. well its just about within limits so unless theres an obvious leak they may well say that .

It may though be a leak .

How far you go with inspecting though is the question , warrenty wont pay for it ..

Check for leaks , scope the cyls i think is what i would do first and depending on that then what to do with the car .. Indy or OPC can do that but you would have to ask .. not just say its useing oil .
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Fastfishracing
Trainee


Joined: 15 Nov 2014
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 30, 2017 8:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I've always been fairly alarmed with the oil usage of mine which has averaged 865 miles per litre. It does change though depending on use - a long euro trip saw much less usage per mile.
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DucatiRob
Suzuka


Joined: 22 Jul 2015
Posts: 1231
Location: Milton Keynes

2006 Porsche 997 Carrera 2S

PostPosted: Sun Apr 30, 2017 9:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Maybe an oil leak that only manifests when under a certain load? I think if the AOS is at fault then you get a strong vacuum from the whe you remove the oil filler cap! Worth a check although not sure if a fault AOS would result in such high oil consumption Dont know
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glenwells
Silverstone


Joined: 20 Aug 2015
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PostPosted: Mon May 01, 2017 6:36 am    Post subject: Do not think there is a leak Reply with quote

Trying not not make assumptions - if all of mine had panned out the way I thought/wanted I would be chatting to Jay Kay about my large Ferrari collection and telling the groundskeeper I am not satisfied with the lawn stripes haha.

I do not think there is an oil leak - driveway clean and under the car is also clean.
I have already been told that I will get the bill for the evaluation work if no problem is found. I am ok with that. Do not want to keep driving round with 4L oil, a measuring jug and paper towels in the bonnet wondering what/if anything is wrong.

I expect it to pan out one of three ways;

'Within tolerances sir' = car will be traded in, cannot accept that in any way.
'Its the X and Y sir -Inchcape warranty covered' = It will be fixed and kept.
'Its the X any Y sir - warranty say p**s off' = will be rejected and returned to dealer under 2015 consumer goods act as only had it 5 months and issue reported at point of purchase.

Kind of hoping for the second one, never thought I would want something to be wrong with a car!

There was a contributor on here in Feb that had the same thing with a 997.2 but they did not post a conclusion of the testing.

Anyhow it is in in two weeks

Regards
Glen
 
  
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DRZ911
Suzuka


Joined: 13 Mar 2013
Posts: 1146
Location: Belfast


PostPosted: Mon May 01, 2017 9:02 am    Post subject: Re: Do not think there is a leak Reply with quote

glenwells wrote:
I expect it to pan out one of three ways;

'Within tolerances sir' = car will be traded in, cannot accept that in any way.
'Its the X and Y sir -Inchcape warranty covered' = It will be fixed and kept.
'Its the X any Y sir - warranty say p**s off' = will be rejected and returned to dealer under 2015 consumer goods act as only had it 5 months and issue reported at point of purchase.

Kind of hoping for the second one, never thought I would want something to be wrong with a car!


A well thought out and sensible approach.

Hope you get the outcome that you want.
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BHZ661
Suzuka


Joined: 03 Feb 2015
Posts: 1002
Location: Milton Keynes


PostPosted: Tue May 02, 2017 7:11 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hope all works out when in at dealer
 
  
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effy
Spa-Francorchamps


Joined: 10 Feb 2014
Posts: 276



PostPosted: Tue May 02, 2017 7:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Glen, it was good speaking with you yesterday, reference the excessive oil usage on the Gen2
As I confirmed to you Porsche are very aware of the early Gen2 oil usage but are trying to keep it quiet. Mine was using more oil than yours is, I was covering 300/400 miles per Litre of oil, when it went into OPC Colchester for it’s major in Feb, I obviously made a point of mentioning my concerns to them the day I took it in, and they said they would do there checks accordingly. (Mine was covered by the OPC warranty)
When the car was delivered back to me all they told me to do was monitor the usage over the next 1K miles?
I wasn’t happy with this outcome and managed to sell my car a short while later, with the transferable warranty in place, I just hope the new owner gets a better result in the event of a potential engine claim, because as you say Glen, this kind of oil consumption isn’t acceptable it’s nothing short of a two stroke engine!!
Good luck Glen
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DucatiRob
Suzuka


Joined: 22 Jul 2015
Posts: 1231
Location: Milton Keynes

2006 Porsche 997 Carrera 2S

PostPosted: Tue May 02, 2017 4:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

300 to 400 miles per litre is shocking! There has to be a good engineering explanation for this, variable driving conditions and engine condition etc will explain variable oil usage to some degree but this level of oil usage points to an issue of some sort or a design flaw, surely Question
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effy
Spa-Francorchamps


Joined: 10 Feb 2014
Posts: 276



PostPosted: Tue May 02, 2017 5:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

It was thoroughly checked by the OPC Colchester from the Friday through to the Wednesday, and they said everything checked out okay, and asked me to monitor it over the next 1k miles, I told them I’d obviously been monitoring it since I’d bought it, this is why I asked it to be checked out? I got the impression they knew it had issues but didn’t want to admit to them? Even though it had the OPC warranty. I was buying Mobil 1, 4 Ltrs per time, car wasn’t smoking at all, and obviously no leaks Confused

Since selling my car I have discovered Porsche were aware of my engines oil consumption, but they never mentioned this to me when I was talking to them!! what
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Demort
Estoril


Joined: 21 Mar 2015
Posts: 3502
Location: Sussex


PostPosted: Tue May 02, 2017 6:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

What i find strange is its not a constant .. one car uses almost no oil and another is heavy usage .. but within Porsche specs of course Razz
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glenwells
Silverstone


Joined: 20 Aug 2015
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PostPosted: Tue May 02, 2017 6:47 pm    Post subject: differences between cars. Reply with quote

I do wonder if it is 'some' early Gen2's that might be a problem.

The two I read about at length on Rennlist, mine and Effys' were ALL late 08/09 Gen2s.

We know that cars have changes applied to them during the span of the model run. Not all changes are openly informed possibly to address an issue?!
Were changes made to piston liners, rings, valves or other components during its production period of the Gen2?

We know that there are differences in the amount of oil these cars use and that fact is not isolated to the Gen2's. I have read and corresponded with people that posted concerns about high oil consumption.

Taking out of the equation cars that have been abused - spanked from cold and had a seriously hard life. Also taking out those extremes of only long or short journeys what could the differences be :- Components or tolerances or luck?

Either way it is components that are not up to the task or poor production standards that allow some engines to use/lose not insignificant amounts of oil.

I must have had about 25+ cars over the years and 5 were Porsche cars. Nothing has come close by a long way to using this amount of oil not even my old well knackered Volvo with a busted piston ring.

There has been some very good advice given to which I am very grateful. As a result I will be requesting that I can see digital images of the pistons condition once checked. I know that the plugs are coming out to be examined.

Regards
Glen
 
  
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Demort
Estoril


Joined: 21 Mar 2015
Posts: 3502
Location: Sussex


PostPosted: Tue May 02, 2017 6:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ask for photos of the spark plugs , they tell us a lot about how an engine is running.
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Nimrod
Nürburgring


Joined: 25 Apr 2015
Posts: 492
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PostPosted: Tue May 02, 2017 7:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

That seems a crazy amount of oil to use on an engine that's supposedly working correctly.

I have never used that much oil in any of the cars I've owned I thought we were past these problems since gen2's came out but having seen one at Hartech with bore scoring and now hearing this it does make you wonder Question
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effy
Spa-Francorchamps


Joined: 10 Feb 2014
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PostPosted: Tue May 02, 2017 7:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I've also been informed through an excellent source that the early Gen 2s as well as excessive oil usage also suffered with PDK issues!!

I have bought myself a BMW M4 which I have so much more confidence in Thumb
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Demort
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PostPosted: Tue May 02, 2017 8:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

PDK issues .. software faults .. many upgrades and as far as im aware long since fixed .
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