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pietrzj
Spa-Francorchamps


Joined: 19 Mar 2014
Posts: 278



PostPosted: Thu Feb 23, 2017 3:46 pm    Post subject: Radio delete but with bluetooth speaker interface Reply with quote

I really dont like the look of my radio and as i didn't switch it on for the first year of driving - I can't resist that engine noise - its time to remove it and blank the hole with a porsche cover. However, I like the idea of keeping the speakers and maybe slipping a bluetooth adaptor/converter behind the cover so I could use my iphone as a head unit. I will hunt around for such a device this weekend.

I never understood what the nokia dsp did in the door pocket and it looks dead, with no lights and no effect when i press the buttons so not sure it has worked since I had the car. Anyone know how to check if its working. Or even better how I could neatly remove it (to be reinstalled if the wife ever says those dreaded 5 words "its the car or me!". worship

Any words of wisdom?
 
  
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Tobesetc
Albert Park


Joined: 02 Jun 2014
Posts: 1594
Location: West London, UK


PostPosted: Thu Feb 23, 2017 4:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

To drive the speakers you'd need an amp in there with the BT receiver and the common term for one of those combinations in a car is "head unit"...

Not sure if a small BT receiver/amp exist that could drive the car speakers and be hidden behind a blanking panel?

Maybe one of these but you couldn't get at the volume control...
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Facor-Portable-Bluetooth-Amplifier-Receiver/dp/B01DVOV4OW

...but...er...why not just get a head-unit.
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Pickled Piper
Suzuka


Joined: 07 Aug 2004
Posts: 1104
Location: United Kingdom


PostPosted: Fri Feb 24, 2017 11:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

There are some nice head units available with the functionality you describe and that look period correct and integrate well with the interior.
 
  
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ToreB
Approved Trader


Joined: 13 May 2010
Posts: 613
Location: Oslo, Norway


PostPosted: Sun Feb 26, 2017 7:00 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

A DSP switch panel on the door indicates that you have the M490 Hi-Fi package. This consists of a Nokia amplifier under the seat, as well as three speakers in each door. The Nokia amp has line inputs, so you could possibly wire this to a bluetooth device of some sort. You also have to enable the amplifier operation by triggering the remote-on signal. Inputs and remote -on signals are placed in the DIN connector of the amp.

If the switch panel is dead, the amp might be disconnected.

Cheers,
Tore
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'95 993 C4

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Porsche electronics specialists, products and repair services.
 



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pietrzj
Spa-Francorchamps


Joined: 19 Mar 2014
Posts: 278



PostPosted: Sun Feb 26, 2017 6:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks Tore, that is a really comprehensive reply and helps me a great deal.

I have found a number of bluetooth receivers and small profile amps that I could sit behind a radioblanking panel, but before I do, with your information, I will explore the DSP a bit more - it would be good to get it working and then decide what I want to do. When you say teh amp is under the seat I did see a unit under the drivers seat, but assumed that was the H&P immobilzer/alarm system. I will have another look at that and trace the wires. Obviously the previous owners have done something as the head unit works fine without the DSP being energized.

Thanks for the help.

Jan
 
  
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ToreB
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Joined: 13 May 2010
Posts: 613
Location: Oslo, Norway


PostPosted: Mon Feb 27, 2017 6:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Exchanging the Nokia amp needs some fiddling, it contains active filtering to work with the door speaker elements. Using one or more aftermarket amplifiers will need crossover filters. Here's how the M490 is bult.
Cheers,
Tore

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Bergvill F/X
Porsche electronics specialists, products and repair services.
 
  
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andyobro
Monza


Joined: 02 Nov 2007
Posts: 214
Location: Poole


PostPosted: Sun Aug 11, 2019 3:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi All,

Bringing this topic back from the dead Smile

I have a Becker Grand Prix with bluetooth calling, a bluetooth adaptor for music and the Nokia DSP upgrade with the 3 speakers in the doors.

I have a whine from the radio when its on, seems to get noiser the longer its on. I have tried all sorts, adding chokes, rewiring the radio, having the alternator checked, etc etc.

I think I have decided I would like to junk the radio, the bluetooth adaptor and the nokia amp under the seat. I'm thinking of replacing it all with a bluetooth Amplifer from Kenwood https://www.kenwood.com/ca/car/marine/kac-m1824bt/ as I dont use the radio, I only ever stream music over booth tooth. I will hide the little control away, maybe in the door where the current nokia control is.

I have then been looking for a radio delete panel, managed to find this 996 part that I think will do the job 9965522530101c, look good and give me a slot for sunglasses storage etc. https://type911shop.co.uk/epages/de867ca1-377e-432e-84fd-bdccf2206766.sf/en_GB/?ObjectPath=/Shops/de867ca1-377e-432e-84fd-bdccf2206766/Products/5799

Has anyone used anything like this before?

I see the suggestion for using the Nokia amp with a bluetooth kit, anyone tried that?
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kingroon
Monza


Joined: 15 Oct 2013
Posts: 183
Location: Brighton, UK


PostPosted: Mon Aug 12, 2019 11:07 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

andyobro wrote:
I have then been looking for a radio delete panel, managed to find this 996 part that I think will do the job 9965522530101c, look good and give me a slot for sunglasses storage etc. https://type911shop.co.uk/epages/de867ca1-377e-432e-84fd-bdccf2206766.sf/en_GB/?ObjectPath=/Shops/de867ca1-377e-432e-84fd-bdccf2206766/Products/5799

Has anyone used anything like this before?

The 924 Stereo Delete works a treat in a 993.. I picked mine up for about £4.. Cool
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KingRoon

Roon's Porsche Journal
 



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andyobro
Monza


Joined: 02 Nov 2007
Posts: 214
Location: Poole


PostPosted: Wed Nov 20, 2019 10:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have been doing some experimenting. I have removed my radio and wired a phono plug into the din connector that Tore gave details of above for the nokia amp (it should be noted that my pin outs in the rectangular connector into the back of the radio are different to the info Tore has). I also had to send some power to the amp to switch it on.

I can now plug this phono connector into my phone and play music directly from the phone to the amp / speakers. The only prob I have is that the gain is not enough on the line out from the phone to the amp, so even at full volume on the phone the music is mid level on the speakers in the car. So I need to see if I can adjust the gain on the amplifier to get the volume up a little. Wonder if anyone knows if thats possible?

If it is possible, i'll plan on using a small bluetooth adaptor like this https://www.amazon.co.uk/Kinivo-Bluetooth-Hands-Free-Multipoint-Connectivity/dp/B06Y2D1ZX8 to enable bluetooth streaming from my phone to the nokia amp.
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ToreB
Approved Trader


Joined: 13 May 2010
Posts: 613
Location: Oslo, Norway


PostPosted: Thu Nov 21, 2019 10:50 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I am interested in the pinout you have discovered, could you please inform of your findings?
Please be aware that the picture show the pinout of the C1 connector on the head unit, seen from the outside, and not the counterpart on the car amp wiring.
Cheers,
Tore
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'95 993 C4

Bergvill F/X
Porsche electronics specialists, products and repair services.
 
  
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andyobro
Monza


Joined: 02 Nov 2007
Posts: 214
Location: Poole


PostPosted: Thu Nov 21, 2019 11:16 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

ToreB wrote:
I am interested in the pinout you have discovered, could you please inform of your findings?
Please be aware that the picture show the pinout of the C1 connector on the head unit, seen from the outside, and not the counterpart on the car amp wiring.
Cheers,
Tore


Hi Tore,

I will double check when back home this evening, I believe it was pins 2 & 3 that where transposed. I checked your pinouts with the becker manual.

My din cable wire colours are very different to the colours you have listed, that's what made me check the Becker manual.

Yes understood the layout is looking at the rear of the stereo Smile

Do you know if the gain is adjustable on the Nokia amp at all?

Cheers Andy
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ToreB
Approved Trader


Joined: 13 May 2010
Posts: 613
Location: Oslo, Norway


PostPosted: Thu Nov 21, 2019 12:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have never digged deep into the Nokia amps, there's at least a couple of versions of them, with and without DSP function. I highly suspect the input sensivity in the pre-amp section to not be adjustable at all.
Cheers,
Tore
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'95 993 C4

Bergvill F/X
Porsche electronics specialists, products and repair services.
 
  
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andyobro
Monza


Joined: 02 Nov 2007
Posts: 214
Location: Poole


PostPosted: Thu Nov 21, 2019 12:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi Tore,

Just found this diagram, this is what I found to be true on my car.
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andyobro
Monza


Joined: 02 Nov 2007
Posts: 214
Location: Poole


PostPosted: Fri Nov 22, 2019 11:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The version of the diagram from my Becker manual. It would seem that pin 6 of the C1 connector can be used for either a subwoofer line out or remote on depending upon the radio.
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ToreB
Approved Trader


Joined: 13 May 2010
Posts: 613
Location: Oslo, Norway


PostPosted: Fri Nov 22, 2019 12:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I now understand.
The Becker Grand Prix C connector pinout is different from the original Becker-made Porsche head units. The original M490 Hi-Fi connector pinout is given in the Nokia Hi-Fi amp pic above in this thread, and was of course a plug-in solution to the Porsche units.

If your GP is connected to the existing M490 amp without an adapter, the wiring has been altered in order to fit to the Grand Prix pinout.
Cheers,
Tore
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'95 993 C4

Bergvill F/X
Porsche electronics specialists, products and repair services.
 
  
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andyobro
Monza


Joined: 02 Nov 2007
Posts: 214
Location: Poole


PostPosted: Fri Nov 22, 2019 1:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ToreB wrote:
I now understand.
The Becker Grand Prix C connector pinout is different from the original Becker-made Porsche head units. The original M490 Hi-Fi connector pinout is given in the Nokia Hi-Fi amp pic above in this thread, and was of course a plug-in solution to the Porsche units.

If your GP is connected to the existing M490 amp without an adapter, the wiring has been altered in order to fit to the Grand Prix pinout.
Cheers,
Tore


What a bunch of crazy Grin you would have thought the pin out for these connectors would have been standardised across all brands. Glad we got to understand a little more thumbsup

Just need to see if I can find a way of increasing the signal between the phone and the amp now. Thinking something like this may do the trick https://www.amazon.co.uk/Level-Booster-Line-Rca-Subwoofer/dp/B009DJI1Z0/ref=pd_rhf_dp_p_img_8?_encoding=UTF8&psc=1&refRID=HMZBPSJQ40V66QT8CWFA

But also thinking that this is all getting a bit complicated and might revert back to my original idea of replacing the Nokia amp with the kenwood amp with built in blue tooth, but then I will need to add cross overs for the front speakers. frustrated
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