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Narrow escape - possible bore scoring.

Hertsdriver said:
RXBoxster said:
they wouldn't have overbored it... as oversized pistons arn't available, and aluminium cylinders either need re-coating in nikasil, or steel liners fitting.
Click to expand...

Apologies you are correct, the invoice states:
"Carry out repair to bare crankcase
Replace cylinder 4/5/6 and machine cylinder to piston
Check roundness of cylinders 1/2/3 and install top brace
check existing pistons and match to new"

3 new OEM pistons are listed in the bill.

I believe the guy has part ex'd the car against an M5 so no doubt it will make its way back into the system....
Click to expand...

OK I'll bite. I read that as Cylinders 4,5,6 all replaced with new liners and 3 new pistons fitted. Pretty standard for Hartech. Cylinders 1,2,3, checked for signs of ovaling and then retaining rings fitted to strengthen them. All of which sounds fine... Now the real question is who did the borescope and do you have any pictures? Nikasil liners will show running in marks on all of them as the piston rings bed in, (the marks are from the rings, not scoring to the bore). The original cylinders in bank 1 may show some marks, but again it is hard to tell if these are actually problematic scores. Did the car have any other borescore symptoms? (Tapping noise from piston slap, high oil consumption/blue smoke on hard acceleration, sooty exhaust tips). Not saying you were wrong to walk away from this car, but I find it very hard to believe all 6 cylinders are now scored?????
 
krispe said:
Now the real question is who did the borescope and do you have any pictures?
Click to expand...

OP said La Rose Porsche who've been around for years... but I agree there is a degree of interpretation to bore-scope pics, and I wonder how many engines have been condemned prematurely to expensive engine work in the absence of any other major symptoms (by which I mean using unusual amounts of oil and sounding like a cement mixer at idle).
 
I'm not sure why you find it hard to believe, its pretty much accepted that these engines (the 3.8) can and do score their bores. The bank that was replaced did it in around 35/40k, the other bank had 100k. Plenty of examples around of cars doing it in less and more mileage.

There were no sooty tips, but when I arrived to look the car over (had asked the owner not to drive it or warm it up so it was stone cold not started for a couple of days) there was a rather large puff of smoke from the right hand exhaust (Off side) which of course could have been the 'they all do that'.

Its just a real shame that had another £500-1000 been spent at the time of the rebuild, the car would have been bulletproof. :dont know:
 
Here are the pics if anyone is interested
 

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Where's the scored ones?
 
Alex said:
Where's the scored ones?
Click to expand...

The last one perhaps? but surely not the others :dont know:
 
The problem with looking at pics like this is that most people are not experienced in interpreting what they are looking at (I include myself in this) and it's easy to think the worst.

I would be interested to hear Baz's comments TBH.
 
I'd say the last photo is the only concern, others look mint. But even that last is debatable.
 
Chris_in_the_UK said:
The problem with looking at pics like this is that most people are not experienced in interpreting what they are looking at (I include myself in this) and it's easy to think the worst.

I would be interested to hear Baz's comments TBH.
Click to expand...

:yeah:

There were some good pics I think on the Bore Score thread, which Baz posted and showed the difference between scoring and normal wear.
 
Looking forward to Baz's post, however, he can only carry out work that was requested despite being (possibly) told more was required?
 
Robertb said:
Chris_in_the_UK said:
The problem with looking at pics like this is that most people are not experienced in interpreting what they are looking at (I include myself in this) and it's easy to think the worst.

I would be interested to hear Baz's comments TBH.
Click to expand...

:yeah:

There were some good pics I think on the Bore Score thread, which Baz posted and showed the difference between scoring and normal wear.
Click to expand...

Agree! It would be good to hear what Baz has to say on this. I am no expert but I have pics of my own scored bores from a few years ago and spent some time with a scope peering into the bores to satisfy myself before investing in a rebuild!

Pics 3 & 4 do look similar to the pics i have of the my scored bores, the other pics look much more like normal wear/scuff marks you would expect to see on perfectly healthy Nikasil cylinders.

Larose Porsche diagnosing all six bores scored suggests they don't understand well enough what they are looking at! Might be worth editing the original post :?:
 
Really hard to understand why anyone would go to the expense of having a Hartech rebuild and only having 3 cylinders done!
 
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