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inchyra
Trainee


Joined: 14 Jul 2016
Posts: 52



PostPosted: Sat May 04, 2019 10:26 am    Post subject: Keep or sell?? Reply with quote

Hi all. I have a March 06 C4S in white with sand. Factory X51 with many extras. 68k miles. FSH (mostly independents) and in the next few months I'm becoming a water gypsy so will then have little need of the car.. Prices don't seem strong at present so I'm wondering whether to store her for a year or two in the hope prices improve or sell this summer ??? Where do we think prices are going??

Chris
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jpsh120
Hockenheim


Joined: 30 Aug 2015
Posts: 746
Location: Somerset


PostPosted: Sat May 04, 2019 11:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Shouldn't you have a crystal ball if you're becoming a water gypsy?
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Luddite
Nürburgring


Joined: 18 Dec 2018
Posts: 406
Location: Scotland


PostPosted: Sat May 04, 2019 12:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Inchyra... Thinking of potential purchasers I suspect many folk may have wakened up to the possible reality that buying combustion engined vehicles ( other than the very rare) for investment purposes may well have passed it`s best some time back, and given the recent impetus behind acceptance of climate change to the extent that some parliaments have declared a climate emergency, may well advance legislation relative to cutting usage of motor vehicles in general, and I suspect recreational usage may be an early target...?

If the majority of Porsches in existence in the UK are perhaps used for other than daily transport, I wonder how many owners might there be who are hanging on to them with hopes based around the idea of "investment potential" using them as rarely as they dare, and over the next months and years may begin to wonder whether to off load them sooner rather than later as the result of possible evolutionary changes in legislation affecting aspects of general usage.. and how that might effect values...?

I am no economist, though I suspect the best returns to be had from a Porsche may be to make use of it as much as you can while you can. Perhaps a bit like the once cast iron investment that houses were thought to be... some folk may think they have made a lot of money out of moving house ever upward in terms of cost.... if they bought wisely on the basis of Location, Location, Location.....and eventually CASHED UP..? In the case of a Porsche I suspect the wise will buy on Condition,Condition, Condition, and two years off the road would seem unlikely to improve on that..? Tyres would be two years older and perhaps develop flat spots, acids trapped in the oil may cause issues, of course the oil will have quite some time to drain out of many places requiring a careful re-start, and what chances are there that the battery will survive, brakes may stick on etc. etc. etc... re-commisioning could have potential for more expense than might be imagined..?

As for advantage...? Well at least the speedo mileage read out will not have increased...? I have read elsewhere on this forum where it seems there are those who may have a measure of experience in Porsche circles and elsewhere, critically questioning the accuracy of speedo mileage readouts on vehicles for sale, I tend to think along very similar lines...hmm. If interested you could beam up

http://911uk.com/viewtopic.php?t=125077&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=40

And start at page three, though no pretty girls..(-; Showing my age again.. Floor

Good luck in your decision making and wishing you fair winds and safe anchorages.. Thumb
 
  
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Counter Of Beans
Spa-Francorchamps


Joined: 10 May 2018
Posts: 314
Location: Hampshire


PostPosted: Sat May 04, 2019 1:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Chris, nobody knows for sure, but my opinion is that prices for mainstream water cooled Porsches will drift gently downwards. There are bound to be exceptions, but I would not expect your car to rise in value over and above the cost of general inflation, storage and recommissioning.
If you (or anyone, really) won't be using a mainstream car for the foreseeable, then sell it, is my advice.
For those that will be using their cars - enjoy while you can, folks, because I think the climate change "movement" will be seized upon by Government - whoever is elected - and ICE cars will be a prime target for taxation. After all, there's only ten years until DISASTER according to the likes of Extinction Rebellion, none of whom drive a Porsche (I'm guessing).
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benbuhagiar
Spa-Francorchamps


Joined: 28 Dec 2014
Posts: 366
Location: Kent

2008 Porsche 997 Carrera 2

PostPosted: Sat May 04, 2019 7:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Luddite wrote:
Inchyra... Thinking of potential purchasers I suspect many folk may have wakened up to the possible reality that buying combustion engined vehicles ( other than the very rare) for investment purposes may well have passed it`s best some time back, and given the recent impetus behind acceptance of climate change to the extent that some parliaments have declared a climate emergency, may well advance legislation relative to cutting usage of motor vehicles in general, and I suspect recreational usage may be an early target...?

If the majority of Porsches in existence in the UK are perhaps used for other than daily transport, I wonder how many owners might there be who are hanging on to them with hopes based around the idea of "investment potential" using them as rarely as they dare, and over the next months and years may begin to wonder whether to off load them sooner rather than later as the result of possible evolutionary changes in legislation affecting aspects of general usage.. and how that might effect values...?

I am no economist, though I suspect the best returns to be had from a Porsche may be to make use of it as much as you can while you can. Perhaps a bit like the once cast iron investment that houses were thought to be... some folk may think they have made a lot of money out of moving house ever upward in terms of cost.... if they bought wisely on the basis of Location, Location, Location.....and eventually CASHED UP..? In the case of a Porsche I suspect the wise will buy on Condition,Condition, Condition, and two years off the road would seem unlikely to improve on that..? Tyres would be two years older and perhaps develop flat spots, acids trapped in the oil may cause issues, of course the oil will have quite some time to drain out of many places requiring a careful re-start, and what chances are there that the battery will survive, brakes may stick on etc. etc. etc... re-commisioning could have potential for more expense than might be imagined..?

As for advantage...? Well at least the speedo mileage read out will not have increased...? I have read elsewhere on this forum where it seems there are those who may have a measure of experience in Porsche circles and elsewhere, critically questioning the accuracy of speedo mileage readouts on vehicles for sale, I tend to think along very similar lines...hmm. If interested you could beam up

http://911uk.com/viewtopic.php?t=125077&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=40

And start at page three, though no pretty girls..(-; Showing my age again.. Floor

Good luck in your decision making and wishing you fair winds and safe anchorages.. Thumb


How depressing!

In my opinion, we are at least 20 years away before electric cars seriously take over. Even then, it doesn’t mean petrol cars won’t exist anymore.

In answer to the OPs question, i’d sell up.
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Porkaholic
Spa-Francorchamps


Joined: 11 Jan 2009
Posts: 288
Location: Cornwall

2009 Porsche 997 Carrera 4S

PostPosted: Sat May 04, 2019 7:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Say the boat hits a rock and sinks assuming RNLi pick you up, you'll need a car then!
Fair to say it's probably not the best investment compared to other non motor products available but a lot more fun. Anyway sounds like a lovely car that could be missed if you sold it.
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Luddite
Nürburgring


Joined: 18 Dec 2018
Posts: 406
Location: Scotland


PostPosted: Sun May 05, 2019 12:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

benbuhagair, apologies if my contribution appeared pessimistic, I prefer to think myself an experienced optimist... (-:

Chris the OP, did seem to have interest in his potentially laid-up Porsche`s value over the timespan envisaged... ?

If we just looked at house price price variations,and that which may have driven the variety of boom and burst situations over as many years as you might care to observe, it seems the MARKET decides, and we all NEED housing.... ? Today in these parts some houses sit on the market for years and some lie empty which is different from a few years back...Shrug. Given the seemingly exponential growth of coverage that climate change is currently getting, to imagine that there will be no likely market movement in so many areas of markets of all sorts that relate to day to day life over time, let alone the effect on the value of that which may be looked upon as a recreational vehicle....????

Markets influences aside, Chris thought his Porsche might be laid-up for perhaps two years...? Having brought a few dead cars back to life in my time I thought to point out some of the possible issues of which Chris may or may not be aware..? Of course it seems wise to employ a measure of cost benefit analysis relative to storage conditions, and given the variables on that alone can vary from throwing a cover over it in the garden to giving it to one of the many specialist companies who will fire it up run it on rollers etc.etc.etc. ?? If left under a cover I wonder what the re-commissioning costs might be relative to those of a employing a specialist storage company where hopefully there would be nothing to stop the key be turned and drive off down the road at any time...? Yeah a lot of variables to contemplate..?

Of course man maths and other subtle influences will ever be at play, complicating current assessment of that which in time may end up as fact, IF we are ever forced to count the true cost of anything, let alone the real value of a Porsche two years down the line..?

Me? I can justify to MYSELF the expenditure on my old car which has lain unused for circa four years, having owned it for circa sixteen years...despite swearing at it regularly in recent times as I am involved in bringing it back to life from being garaged in a Scottish climate over that time... It will have a monetary value, though how that might be calculated relative to the time effort and money I have spent on it over 16 years would take both an accurate record of expenditure and accounting skills that far exceed my capabilities, let alone desires, and having covered circa 25k miles during my ownership the cost per mile right at this moment in time might be thought to be ...??? There was a time when it`s cash value played more importance than it does now, but then is that not par for the course given the amount of enjoyment derived over time during ownership, which can be a whole lot different from the evaluation very soon after paying out how much of ones hard earned coin...???

Another vital factor in the equation How much my/any old car might be worth assuming there is any market for it that matches current advertised prices, and what it might actually sell for..??? Trying to bring together all those numbers without the sale having been concluded seems to be well beyond my minimal mathematical skill-set... (-: HOWEVER right at this time I am comfortable that I have no immediate DEPENDENCE on it`s market or possible sale value, which would seem to be a critical factor for many folk who buy into the idea that if the brown stuff hits the fan they can derive at least some cash returns from their Porsche/classic car.... as for PROFIT, well now that seem to be a whole different story...?

As for predicting electric cars may take over in circa 20 years... hmm ? perhaps that is a discussion for elsewhere on the forum, If I look at the number of cars on the road in the UK and think of the manufacturing marketing repair and tax pounds involved in every aspect of that...? Confidence in governmental decision making processes right at the moment ....hmm..

I suspect in these times I would not care to predict too much with any degree of confidence.... other than my old car WILL be on the road soon...I hope Floor
 
  
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MattyR
Hockenheim


Joined: 21 Sep 2015
Posts: 656
Location: Somewhere Nr Tunbridge Wells, Kent


PostPosted: Sun May 05, 2019 7:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Love your posts Luddite Thumb
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Johnd52
Montreal


Joined: 06 Oct 2014
Posts: 590
Location: North Yorkshire

2011 Porsche Cayman 987

PostPosted: Sun May 05, 2019 7:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

If it is nothing special, other than being a Porsche, then flog it and move on. One less thing to worry about whilst floating away!

Even the most optimistic outlook is not going to make much impact on values of non GT cars. There will be a cost to keep it serviced etc. Which will offset any potential gain.
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Luddite
Nürburgring


Joined: 18 Dec 2018
Posts: 406
Location: Scotland


PostPosted: Mon May 06, 2019 4:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

MattyR Thanks, but beware, are the ramblings of an old duffer and anything I type can be well past it`s sell by date.

Johnd52 Good advice Thumb
 
  
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bobi61
Silverstone


Joined: 13 Mar 2016
Posts: 118



PostPosted: Mon May 06, 2019 6:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Reluctantly I would sell it ,, then if the bottom falls out and you have saved your money buy back in !! Thumb
 
  
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inchyra
Trainee


Joined: 14 Jul 2016
Posts: 52



PostPosted: Tue May 07, 2019 9:08 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Many thanks gentlemen. Some points I hadn't considered - proliferation of electric cars??!!

Hey-ho at least the depreciation over last 3 years will seem as nothing compared with the boat!

I'd better write an advert.

Sad
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MarkC4S
Monza


Joined: 05 Jul 2016
Posts: 194



PostPosted: Tue May 07, 2019 9:28 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rather than worry about electric vehicles I'd have thought the imminent (just 3 years away) legislation to prevent all new cars exceeding the speed limits will have a far greater impact and may well lead to a spike in demand for cars (any cars) that continue to allow driver freedom of control. Let's face it why would any current high performance car buyer, purchase one after 2022 if not for track use. This could mean a modest lay-up could yield a better price??
 
  
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cableguy
Kyalami


Joined: 10 Sep 2007
Posts: 1996
Location: North Yorkshire


PostPosted: Tue May 07, 2019 9:52 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Johnd52 wrote:
If it is nothing special, other than being a Porsche, then flog it and move on. One less thing to worry about whilst floating away!

Even the most optimistic outlook is not going to make much impact on values of non GT cars. There will be a cost to keep it serviced etc. Which will offset any potential gain.


Spot on. Sell it and move on... Many bash on about hindsight but life is for living, so onwards and wetwards for you. Grin

C.
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MaxA
Albert Park


Joined: 11 Oct 2015
Posts: 1559
Location: Helsinki


PostPosted: Tue May 07, 2019 11:07 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

It looks to me as if you've a whole garage to sell. On the other hand, if you have a garage to store your collection, and can afford a little man to sort things out, then keep it. It just won't be appreciating...
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T8
General
General


Joined: 29 Jun 2010
Posts: 15759
Location: Kent


PostPosted: Tue May 07, 2019 11:16 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

991.1s are still depreciating - albeit very slowly- which has pushed all 997 values down from where they were.

My guess is that yours will never be worth more than it is now so unless you fear you'll never find a replacement that suits you as well as this one does it would probably be best to let her go.

Keeping a car unused doesn't do it any favours and can be expensive.
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