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Chris_in_the_UK
Estoril


Joined: 19 Mar 2014
Posts: 3564
Location: Harrogate


PostPosted: Mon Feb 11, 2019 9:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Phew!!.

I think it's sometimes worth remembering that some of the tuning/aftermarket outfits (whilst well intended) are adding and changing stuff to get results - albeit with the best intentions, they are not playing the longer game like the original manufacturer.

Sometimes the spend is high and the returns are low but perceived (placebo even?).

Matters not if you are racing or using a vehicle as a 'shop window' and factor in regular rebuilds/refresh, but when it's a daily or regular drive some of the 'bling' is not such a good idea IMHO.

Not like the cars are slow is it?.
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wasz
Sepang


Joined: 28 Dec 2012
Posts: 2916


1999 Porsche 996 Carrera 2

PostPosted: Mon Feb 11, 2019 9:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

maldren wrote:
Not sure I fully agree with Wasz, I would expect that the ring gear on the flywheel is steel and shrunk onto the alloy flywheel, cast iron flywheels are usually like this.

If the flywheel is undamaged, it may be possible to just have a new ring gear fitted and saving quite a lot - try asking the manufacturer.


Aha I hadn;t thought of that!

But glad I was partially right.

I would go DMF for the sake of your crank, the nose of the crank is a long way unsupported and the main bearings aren't known to be great.....but I've never driven a LWFW
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Luddite
Monza


Joined: 18 Dec 2018
Posts: 242
Location: Scotland


PostPosted: Tue Feb 12, 2019 11:17 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

996lee, sorry to read of your problem, I hope that you manage to resolve it with minimum fuss and bother. There is all sorts of invaluable advice to be found on this forum from folk who have been there and done that.... Of course the word of deMort is to be ignored at your peril and it seems to me that Chris_in_the_uk likewise...

I would have tended to expect that your lightweight flywheel would indeed have a steel ring gear that would be replaceable by any skilled mechanic... HOWEVER given the pic you posted my old eyes do not detect such a ring gear, though had the pic been of the other side of the flywheel we could perhaps have had a better chance of making a more accurate determination....?

As for the assumption that any kind of alloy could not take the wear and tear of the starting process, I would not be so sure..?

My vote would be to replace the lightweight flywheel with the original DMF But then I am perhaps no more than a BOF... Boring old F

Just thinking in type. Question
 
  
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maldren
Suzuka


Joined: 07 Oct 2016
Posts: 1065



PostPosted: Tue Feb 12, 2019 11:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

wasz wrote:
maldren wrote:
Not sure I fully agree with Wasz, I would expect that the ring gear on the flywheel is steel and shrunk onto the alloy flywheel, cast iron flywheels are usually like this.

If the flywheel is undamaged, it may be possible to just have a new ring gear fitted and saving quite a lot - try asking the manufacturer.


Aha I hadn;t thought of that!

But glad I was partially right.

I would go DMF for the sake of your crank, the nose of the crank is a long way unsupported and the main bearings aren't known to be great.....but I've never driven a LWFW


No problem, you're always so spot on that I doubted myself!
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2003 996.2 C2 Coupe Arctic Silver
 
  
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996lee
Hockenheim


Joined: 26 Aug 2014
Posts: 697
Location: Nottingham


PostPosted: Tue Feb 12, 2019 5:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Here's another couple of pics
And it does appear to be one piece
Wether it is alloy or not I have no idea






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Marky911
Indianapolis


Joined: 04 Jun 2009
Posts: 2323



PostPosted: Tue Feb 12, 2019 6:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Looks like a lucky escape then Lee. You want to get the lottery put on this week as well with luck like that. Wink

I’ve said before, I love LWFW’s, they transform the feel of a car and I did weigh it up for mine last year, however I just think these engines have enough issues without giving them the chance of more.

There is the other school of thought that the lighter flywheel causes less stress on the final crank bearing due to less weight/mass.

I’d consider myself lucky and go back to standard, unless RPM gave a free replacement but since it was technically the starter at fault maybe the flywheel would otherwise have been fine.
 
  
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Luddite
Monza


Joined: 18 Dec 2018
Posts: 242
Location: Scotland


PostPosted: Tue Feb 12, 2019 8:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Lee I see no obvious line around the base of the teeth such as can be seen on removable ring gears so you may be correct that it is all one piece.

I guess the supplier could provide you with accurate details of it`s construction...?

At this stage I assume nothing has been proven..? I guess when the starter is/was removed assessment will move one stage further on, if it nothing evident and it still does not turn over. either via a socket on the crankshaft pulley or putting it in gear and rocking...? Perhaps best leave it at that and hope the starter is at fault at this stage until you hear back from the garage..?

Keeping my fingers crossed ...
 
  
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996lee
Hockenheim


Joined: 26 Aug 2014
Posts: 697
Location: Nottingham


PostPosted: Tue Feb 12, 2019 8:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Luddite wrote:
Lee I see no obvious line around the base of the teeth such as can be seen on removable ring gears so you may be correct that it is all one piece.

I guess the supplier could provide you with accurate details of it`s construction...?

At this stage I assume nothing has been proven..? I guess when the starter is/was removed assessment will move one stage further on, if it nothing evident and it still does not turn over. either via a socket on the crankshaft pulley or putting it in gear and rocking...? Perhaps best leave it at that and hope the starter is at fault at this stage until you hear back from the garage..?

Keeping my fingers crossed ...


Yep the starter was jammed and had to be pulled out with mole grips apparently

I've decided to go for a lwfw again as I don't blame the flywheel and I've honestly loved it as a modification

It gets delivered to the garage tomorrow but forgot to ask what it was made out of but will find out
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Johnd52
Montreal


Joined: 06 Oct 2014
Posts: 542
Location: North Yorkshire

2011 Porsche Cayman 987

PostPosted: Tue Feb 12, 2019 8:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Good to hear that it is sorted and just very expensive rather than ruinous. Hope it can be fixed quickly.

Time to get the magnet out!
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maldren
Suzuka


Joined: 07 Oct 2016
Posts: 1065



PostPosted: Wed Feb 13, 2019 9:12 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

A magnet will show whether it's steel or alloy....
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2003 996.2 C2 Coupe Arctic Silver
 
  
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wasz
Sepang


Joined: 28 Dec 2012
Posts: 2916


1999 Porsche 996 Carrera 2

PostPosted: Wed Feb 13, 2019 10:31 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

That must be a steel flywheel.

See the inner ring with two teeth missing?

Thats the trigger for the crank sensor.

Crank sensor is a hall effect sensor that measures magentic field.

When a tooth goes before the sensor it will detect the change in magnetic field and produce a waveform. From the teeth it will get a square waveform telling the ECU the RPM. From the missing tooth it will know the crank angle (hence the ECU then knows when the engine is at TDC).

So it needs a ferrous material to work the hall sensor.
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deMort
Long Beach


Joined: 21 Mar 2015
Posts: 6500
Location: Brighton


PostPosted: Wed Feb 13, 2019 8:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Agree

Image of a scope pattern .. what the car sees showing the missing tooth ..
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996lee
Hockenheim


Joined: 26 Aug 2014
Posts: 697
Location: Nottingham


PostPosted: Sat Feb 16, 2019 11:28 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Picked the car up yesterday all sorted
February been an expensive month so far

Will post a pic of the flywheel with the damaged teeth shortly
Mike at zentrum did say something interesting that has got me going back through my cars receipt collection

As per when I last had the clutch and fly changed before (not at zentrum) I asked the "while you've got the gearbox off can you check the IMS and could you also confirm which IMS I have in it"
As I forgot to ask that last time at Steve bulls
Anyway mike thinks my engine has been replaced at some point as it doesn't have the older model dual and it doesn't have the cross over single row I had expected
But said it's got a larger 22mm (I think that's what he said) that you wouldn't expect to of found in my "Y reg " car
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MisterCorn
Long Beach


Joined: 08 Jan 2011
Posts: 6947
Location: Nottingham, England

2004 Porsche 996 Turbo

PostPosted: Sat Feb 16, 2019 12:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Check the engine number, that will tell you the engine type, year of manufacture, and whether it is a factory recon unit.

MC
 
  
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deMort
Long Beach


Joined: 21 Mar 2015
Posts: 6500
Location: Brighton


PostPosted: Sat Feb 16, 2019 4:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

If its got the larger Nut then it has had a replacement engine fitted and probably on extended warrenty.

I think it was 06 when these came out .. which btw no one told us and it was only when fitting the first of these we kinda went .. hold on thats different !

As MC says .. have a look at the engine number .. ill also bet the engine number and whats on your log book / paper work dont match .
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