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Joined: 04 Jun 2008
Posts: 1245
Location: Hampshire

PostPosted: Mon Jun 17, 2013 10:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Nice write up, they are an easy fit on regular rims Wink

TyreSure is a UK brand of the Orange kit with a premium price, the battery life is largely irrelevant as the housing will only survive a couple of tyre changes and eventually crack in my experience. Replacement sensors and valves are pretty cheap, make sure you don't over tighten the clamping nuts, only need about 10NM....you'll damage the seals if you do and have a leak Wink
Life is short, don't waste it growing up
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Joined: 20 Aug 2012
Posts: 5447
Location: Liverpool

2014 Porsche Boxster 981

PostPosted: Fri Jul 05, 2013 1:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

An update on the TPMS install........

I've had the sensors fitted by my local underground tyre fitter on the "dock road". You know when you are in a salubrious place when the large sign on the wall states "Polite Notice to all Customer - NO SPITTING". I joke not Surprised

To be fair the guys where great, both taking car of the wheels including how they jacked the car up and spending some time with me "fine tuning" the sensor fitment.

For reference I paid £40 for fitting the sensors, balancing and a repair to one of the rear tyres which we found a nail through the centre.

The problem we faced on fitment was that as the valves where secured in place ie tightened to the correct torque so that the rubber seals were air tight the sensor did not have enough tolerance to the wheel. In effect the nuts I had used as spacers where very slightly too big and did not allow enough screw thread past the sensor. We solved this by using a combination of washers to allow us to fine tune the sensor securing screw fitment.

Here is one the sensors securely fitted....

So you can fit adapt the hollow spoke valves by simply drilling and threading and then using the standard TPMS kit sensor securing screw. You just need to ensure you have enough suitable washer to fine tune the spacer distance to fit.

So job done Hand Mad

Turned the system on and .............. one sensor not working PC Sad

So a little research, dialogue with the manufacturer (in Tiawan which was fun) etc..... and I have established the following.......

The Orange (Tyresure) system was modified (read improved) sometime in 2012. Prior to this date the sensors worked as follows (bear in mind these are sealed units so once the battery is fitted in manufacture there is no off button) -

- ambient air pressure = sleep mode (ie very little power useage but some)

- tyre pressure (ie when fitted) the sensor permanently sends a signal every 30 seconds even when the car is parked up.

The change to the system in 2012 was to use a more intelligent "G series" sensor which work as follows......

- ambient air pressure = sleep mode (ie very little power useage but some)

- for 24 hour after installation = transmit every 30 seconds

- car speed under 30km/hr Then transmits 3 times every 10 minutes

- car speed over 30km/hr transmit every 20 seconds

- fault detected transmits every 30 seconds even when parked

Here is the crunch = the newer G series intelligent sensors are not backward compatible and cannot be connected to the older display units PC

So armed with this information I am assuming as I bought mine "cheap" off eBay it is probably old stock using the older sensors. If this is the case then although in sleep mode is as per the new sensors it will be older and hence one of the sensors has probably run out of power.

I will therefore need to order a new sensor but the old type. I can get these for c £35 delivered from Tiawan but am waiting for the UK distributor to quote me happy Very Happy or not Judge It will then cost me £10 to get it fitted which should be a 5 min job as the adapted valve is already fitted.

This leaves the dilema of the other valves ie how long will the batteries last in those if one has gone Question

I have decided just to replace the faulty / dead battery one. Hopefully this will allow me enough time to test the system and see how much I like it. First impressions (albeit with 3 tyre readings) are excellent. If I get a real benefit from the system then I will probably stump up for a full newer system using the G series sensors which I can get for c£110 from Tiawan. Those will suit my needs better as my car will spend long spells not being driven so battery life should be much longer.

I now just have to work on fitting the display in the car and permanent wiring Thumb

More to follow when I finish the job bye
"Great spirits have always encountered opposition from mediocre minds" Einstein
1997 Porsche 911 993 C4S My Journal
2014 Porsche Boxster GTS My Journal
2017 BMW 740 Msport
2017 RR Evoque Autobiography
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Joined: 14 Jan 2013
Posts: 544
Location: Lancashire

2004 Porsche 996 Turbo

PostPosted: Fri Jul 05, 2013 1:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Do you know how the signal is sent to the display from the sensors John?

I am wondering if there could be a way to get the output display to my Pioneer Avic system. Either by Bluetooth, or one of the spare inputs I have on the back of the unit.

996Turbo Cab
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Joined: 20 Aug 2012
Posts: 5447
Location: Liverpool

2014 Porsche Boxster 981

PostPosted: Fri Jul 05, 2013 4:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I don't think you can use another display as they all run on the same wireless frequency and transmit an ID code ie you need customised software to understand the I'd and stats transmitted Dont know
"Great spirits have always encountered opposition from mediocre minds" Einstein
1997 Porsche 911 993 C4S My Journal
2014 Porsche Boxster GTS My Journal
2017 BMW 740 Msport
2017 RR Evoque Autobiography
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Joined: 13 Sep 2018
Posts: 1

PostPosted: Fri Nov 02, 2018 1:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Time for a progress report. The short story is that the internal TPMS and valve stems I purchased from TST did not fit on 2012 Sprinter steel wheels. I had a short time to test them and the pressure and temperature monitoring and display console worked great. Now I am waiting for the correct parts.

Here is the long story. Anyone wanting an internal TPMS for a 2012 or later Sprinter might want to read this.

I chose the Truck Systems Technologies (TST) https://mechanicguides.com/best-tire-pressure-systems/ 507 internal TPMS for my dually Sprinter. As explained in an earlier post, an internal system is best because it reads accurate temperatures, is not easily damaged, cannot be stolen, and with new valve stems it is easy to add air. I told TST I had a 2012 dually 3500 Sprinter and needed 2-inch valve stems. I installed in a couple of hours the receiver and repeater myself at home before leaving on a 2-month trip to Florida. Weather was bad in Indiana so I waited and found a truck tire place, Neece Tire and Auto Service, in Tallahassee, which listed TPMS on their web site. We were not expecting any problems so we waited patiently for 6 hours (!) while they installed them. Some of this time the mechanic helped others move around very large truck tires. The service advisor did not mention any problems. Towards the end I ventured past the “No customers beyond this point” sign to see what the mechanic was doing. He was very upset and frustrated saying that on every tire he installed the components as provided, then it leaked so he had to take it apart and substitute different parts. The nut would not fit on the valve stem so he was putting on a smaller nut that was very hard to tighten. I asked him to set the pressures to the label on the door, 54 front and 61 rear. He finally said they were all done and we could leave now.

We were hungry and it was late so we paid the $160 bill ($25 per tire plus tax) and left. The pressures being reported in the monitor were all very high, about 75 psi (which is near the max cold pressure written on the tire), so after eating I checked the pressures with a pressure gauge and indeed they were that high. The tire pressure gauge that the mechanic at Neece Tire used must have been wrong??? So I lowered them to about 5 over the pressures on the label (the tires were warm). The pressure monitor worked perfectly. The high-pressure alarms went off before I lowered them and afterwards all six tires reported the same pressure as the pressure I set them to.

Then the nightmare started. On the way to our campsite about 30 miles away, some of the tires started losing air. The front right went down from 60 to 40 in a few hours, so I jacked up that tire for the night since I was sure it would be completely flat in the morning and I did not want to damage the tire and I wanted to be able to inflate it with the 12V pump that Mercedes provides with the van.

At this point we figured that the Neece mechanic put so much pressure in the tires because they did not leak at that pressure or because it would be longer before they went flat. His pressure gauge would not be off by 20 psi.

I called Mike at TST and explained what happened. He seemed surprised and suggested I call the valve expert Bill “Borg” (Falkenborg) in California. Bill sighed and said TST must not know about the changes in Sprinter wheels mid-way through the 2012 model year. He knew right away that the valve stems that TST provides would not work. The nut on the valve stem needs to be on the inside for these wheels since there is no room for it on the outside. We needed special valve stems that he has developed and sells for $140. I am sure there are lots of posts about his valve stems for Sprinter duallys on this forum. The stems are chrome and are different for the front, rear inside, and rear outside. You can reach them easily to add air and they should work fine with an internal TPMS. If you want to rotate tires you can do it only right to left, but he said that if tires are balanced and aligned properly they do not need to be rotated. If they cause trouble or leak, Borg Equipment and Supply will pay any additional installation or repair costs. Bill said that installation should cost $20 +/- 5 and there should be no problems.

I called back Mike at TST and explained what Bill Borg had said. Mike said he would call Bill and call me back. He did and his solution was that he would pay for Borg’s valve stems but would not pay for their shipping and for my $160 first try expense, nor would he pay for the installation of the new ones. I accepted that since I feel partly to blame for letting the Neece mechanic work for 6 hours without proactive investigation.

In the morning I added air with the pump (the MBz pump took about 15 minutes for the flat tire and needed to cool before the next one). Then we headed back to Neece Tire and Auto Service and asked for the person in charge. Mr. Neece was very defensive and after a few minutes that seemed an eternity I was able to get some words in to tell him that we now realize that the parts we provided from TST were not the right ones. But why did they install them anyway when they all leaked? He said that they did not leak when we left and the pressures were so high because the gauge was defective. I had no way to prove he was wrong, but later I found out he was wrong when we overheard the mechanic say to a foreman that they were indeed leaking after he finished installing them. Mr. Neece said that they would put back regular rubber valve stems, give us back all our parts, and charge us $15 per tire for that work. I explained that I would report all this on the forums and he didn’t care. In the end the service manager did not charge us for removing the TPMS, but a refund of the original $160 was out of the question. Not to mention our time of about 12 hours counting the drive back from our campsite.

So Bill Borg shipped the new valve stems to our next address where we would be in a week. The valve stems looked good so I took them to a Sears’s auto center for installation. The foreman at Sears and I could not figure out how to install them (no directions were included) so I called Bill Borg. He asked me some questions about my wheels, which have round holes, and said that I have a 2012.5 Sprinter and he had sent me the wrong parts. I told him I would wait until I got home in March, a few weeks from now, and he said he would send the correct ones and pay the postage.

You are probably wondering, as my wife is, why I am going through all this hell just to be able to monitor the tire pressures and temperatures. I still think this is an important safety system and will be worth the trouble when this is all over. After all, it is so important that our government has required TPMS in all new 4-wheel vehicles and may soon require in all trucks. As I said above, except the leaking problems, the TST internal 507 TPMS worked perfectly and I will not change my mind on my choice of this system.
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