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DRZ911
Barcelona


Joined: 13 Mar 2013
Posts: 1351
Location: Belfast


PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2018 6:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

david_yorkshire wrote:
Fault report:
One of the camshaft followers on bank 2 (right) has a flat spot with a corresponding wear mark on the bank 2 camshaft

From past experience on a similar problem, this is probably not an inherent material failure but rather a design issue related to insufficient lubrication between the surfaces.
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Diggermeister
Spa-Francorchamps


Joined: 26 May 2015
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 24, 2018 11:02 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Bigfra wrote:

I have some sexy European S355G10+M plate if you fancy it mate Grin
In the mid 90's, we began using a sub-contractor in South Korea who was making parts for Daewoo (now Doosan) excavators. The component was a design we'd made in the UK (in EN19) and sold successfully for several years. We had component failures, due to brittleness after induction hardening, so we sent the parts for analysis at a lab in the Black Country. The failure was due to inclusions, irregularities.neffectively lower quality steel.

However, they also reckoned the alloy differences were making the components more brittle. Very minor changes in elements like silicon and manganese make significant differences.

Another Korean manufacturer, Samsung (now Volvo) began to have component failures from a part sourced from the same factory. By this time, not only had we predicted this, but we had also pre-empitvely made a batch of parts, in the UK, from European steel, which sold out.

We are still seeing reports similar failures on (presumably now Chinese or Indian) components. All of our manufacturing is not only UK now, but also in house. We have zero reported failures...
 
  
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david_yorkshire
Spa-Francorchamps


Joined: 05 Feb 2009
Posts: 281
Location: Herts


PostPosted: Fri Mar 30, 2018 7:28 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

just to conclude the thread;
new engine fitted by OPC Cambs; pretty quick too - they must be getting faster Very Happy

Lets see how long this one lasts.

Interestingly, the last two both failed just before the service was due; over long intervals ? who knows..

Right - whens the next trackday ?!
Floor
 
  
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G2
Imola


Joined: 26 Oct 2015
Posts: 824



PostPosted: Fri Mar 30, 2018 7:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

david_yorkshire wrote:
just to conclude the thread;
new engine fitted by OPC Cambs; pretty quick too - they must be getting faster Very Happy

Lets see how long this one lasts.

Interestingly, the last two both failed just before the service was due; over long intervals ? who knows..

Right - whens the next trackday ?!
Floor


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Gazc2
Albert Park


Joined: 08 Nov 2003
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 30, 2018 8:26 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I like your positive approach David best of luck and enjoy Thumb
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david_yorkshire
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Joined: 05 Feb 2009
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 30, 2018 8:43 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

its not really the end of the world, is it ?

All handled seamlessly by the OPC, and I get a new Cayman S to rag around for a week or so.

Car will be in for an interim service next month !
 
  
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911UK
Porsche Community
Porsche Community


Joined: 15 May 2002
Posts: 9634
Location: 911UK

1997 Porsche 993 Carrera 2

PostPosted: Fri Mar 30, 2018 10:23 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

david_yorkshire wrote:
its not really the end of the world, is it ?

All handled seamlessly by the OPC, and I get a new Cayman S to rag around for a week or so.

Car will be in for an interim service next month !


did they advise what engine update you have been fitted with ?

keep us posted on this engine journey thumbsup
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DynoMike
Barcelona


Joined: 25 May 2012
Posts: 1419
Location: The Cotswolds

2003 Porsche 996 Turbo

PostPosted: Fri Mar 30, 2018 11:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The problem is a lubrication failure, without doubt. When cams are designed, the designer has to calculate Hz stresses between the lobe and follower, which essentially calculate the lubricant thickness vs load/area.

IMHO. the fact that the tappet clearance is by hydraulic not mechanical means, it follows that the cam/follower contact patch never gets a rest, i.e., there is always contact which prevents lubrication. So... that may be a contributory reason for Porsche going mechanical on the later 991.2 engines.

I'm surprised that a specific oil has not been advised for these engines, or at least an additive package.

Just my 2p

Mike
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david_yorkshire
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Joined: 05 Feb 2009
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Location: Herts


PostPosted: Fri Mar 30, 2018 11:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

possibly not;
I've found out that the 'G' series engine is NOT the guaranteed solution to the DLC issue; Only G05374 engines and above are 'fixed'
My G series that has just been replaced was G01293; and failed.
I dont know (yet...) what the engine number of the new engine is.

David
 
  
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squelch
Spa-Francorchamps


Joined: 05 Jun 2016
Posts: 291
Location: Bucks


PostPosted: Fri Mar 30, 2018 2:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Does anyone know if the engine failures / problems also affected the 991.1 GT3 RS models too? (apologies if this has already been asked / answered)
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david_yorkshire
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Location: Herts


PostPosted: Fri Mar 30, 2018 4:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

apparently not
 
  
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seanyboy
Trainee


Joined: 22 Aug 2014
Posts: 52



PostPosted: Fri Apr 06, 2018 12:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Has this affected a lot of cars? I’m guessing it’s not down to higher miles or a heavier right foot, I’m in the market for a gt3 and wondering if this should be putting me off!
 
  
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Disco
Estoril


Joined: 13 May 2008
Posts: 3848
Location: Hertfordshire

2010 Porsche 997 GT3

PostPosted: Fri Apr 06, 2018 5:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

seanyboy wrote:
Has this affected a lot of cars? I’m guessing it’s not down to higher miles or a heavier right foot, I’m in the market for a gt3 and wondering if this should be putting me off!


It has affected enough cars to be a genuine concern and quite a few cars have had multiple engines, but should it put you off? For me that would depend on whether you were planning to change it from stock spec or keep it for long enough for it to be beyond the reach of warranty cover. For me personally I wouldn't entertain running one outside of factory warranty.

There is also an edge case to consider - I once met someone who (when the car was only a couple of years old) had experienced issues that had already caused them to have to abandon 3 separate European track day trips. When I met them their plan was to get it fixed and then git rid of it as they had had enough.

BUT

Meanwhile there are still plenty of people who have had them for ages, extensively used for intended purpose and who say that they have never had any issue.

So it is a bit of a dice roll really. But if you view the warranty as a running cost then that it isn't necessarily a bad bet.

Or you could just go 996/997... Cool
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DRZ911
Barcelona


Joined: 13 Mar 2013
Posts: 1351
Location: Belfast


PostPosted: Fri Apr 06, 2018 5:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

david_yorkshire wrote:
possibly not;
I've found out that the 'G' series engine is NOT the guaranteed solution to the DLC issue; Only G05374 engines and above are 'fixed'
My G series that has just been replaced was G01293; and failed.
I don't know (yet...) what the engine number of the new engine is.

David, did you ever get your new engine number and is it after G05374 Question
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Diggermeister
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Joined: 26 May 2015
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PostPosted: Tue Apr 10, 2018 7:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

squelch wrote:
Does anyone know if the engine failures / problems also affected the 991.1 GT3 RS models too? (apologies if this has already been asked / answered)
You have to remember that, counterintuitively, the 991.1 Gt3 revs higher than the RS; 9,00rpm, vs. 8,800.

There are other differences to the engines too. I am not saying the higher rev limit is the cause of the issue, although of course higher valve train speeds will not be helpful where another problem already exists.

More about the RS engine here: http://www.evo.co.uk/porsche/911/gt3-rs/page/0/2

I don't buy the lubrication explanation. To me, that would affect more cars (all of them surely?) if it were the principal cause. I'd guess a mechanical/metalurgical deficiency or variance in components is the cause.
 
  
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