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infrasilver
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2001 Porsche 996 Targa

PostPosted: Sat Jun 11, 2016 11:42 am    Post subject: Difference's, X74 -30mm suspension and standard ride height Reply with quote

I have replaced all the suspension parts that were worn and also upgraded to some Bilstein B6 struts all round. I had my geometry re-set this morning and the guy mentioned he'd run out of adjustment on the rear to get it to X74 spec. I've had it mentioned before that it won't adjust all the way but it does handle pretty good in its current setting but I assume it will be better if I can get it correct. I'm think it was more negative camber he was trying get?
I would get down to CG but I know how booked up they get and it's something I want sorting ASAP.

I know the X74 is -30mm lower than standard but I assumed this was just down to shocks and springs, are there other parts that were different that will allow me to get the exact X74 set up I'm after? I may be disappointed once it does but I would like to try and I may save going through two sets of rear tyres a year.
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Last edited by infrasilver on Mon Jun 13, 2016 9:14 am; edited 1 time in total
 
  
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Chris_in_the_UK
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PostPosted: Sat Jun 11, 2016 12:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

If it helps Chris, I had the same problem when I fitted B6's and lowered springs. Despite my best efforts I could net get enough toe adjustment as well.

The camber was not the biggest issue for me as it was not massively out - I ended up making some adjustable toe arms to sort the issue out.

http://www.911uk.com/viewtopic.php?t=111202&highlight=toe
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ragpicker
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PostPosted: Sat Jun 11, 2016 12:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yeah, I'd either put more camber on to achieve the toe you want, or make/buy some toe arms and achieve it that way. As you know though, it can be a nightmare to get the geo right on these cars because the camber and toe are interlinked
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infrasilver
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PostPosted: Sat Jun 11, 2016 12:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

That makes a bit more sense, getting the adjustable toe arms. I was looking at them before I poly bushed mine last week but it may be worth just selling on my poly bushed ones as the price I will get would almost pay for some rose jointed arms and it'll look cool Cool

I'll have a read of your thread Chris when I get a minute.
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infrasilver
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 13, 2016 9:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I've had a read through your thread and now I'm wondering if the cost difference was worth making your own unless the Motorsport parts weren't too eye watering. There are sets available including the chamfered outer end stud for around £400, obviously I would rather have the same results for less cost.

I had the car on track at Croft yesterday (with crap set up) and it felt good but I still would like to be able to adjust it to correct spec.

Anyway I've just started thinking out the box and wondered if the chamfer for the front track rod end ball joint of the steering rack are the same as the toe arm outer, if so this would be easy to have the inner end made up with a threaded bar and rose joint.

Thoughts?


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Chris_in_the_UK
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 13, 2016 10:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Same taper Chris.

I nearly went that route but didn't - cant for the life of me remember why?.

EDIT - It was due to needing a piece of stud with opposing threads at each end to facilitate adjustment (I think)......
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infrasilver
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 13, 2016 10:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I found these while researching, I'm just not sure what thread I'll need?

I assumed McGill MS would have sold them but there was nothing on their website.


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Chris_in_the_UK
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 13, 2016 11:21 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The track rod ends are M14 x 1.5.
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infrasilver
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 13, 2016 11:30 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Chris_in_the_UK wrote:
The track rod ends are M14 x 1.5.


Thumb


I've just ordered a track rod end to see what I can make of it, then a rod with a LH/RH thread and a rose jointed end, I'm hoping for some kind of success.
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neil allan
Nürburgring


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2003 Porsche 996 Turbo

PostPosted: Mon Jun 13, 2016 1:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

infrasilver wrote:
I found these while researching, I'm just not sure what thread I'll need?

I assumed McGill MS would have sold them but there was nothing on their website.




I will ask McGill later this week as I will be going to see them about some parts anyway.
 
  
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infrasilver
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 13, 2016 2:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

neil allan wrote:
infrasilver wrote:
I found these while researching, I'm just not sure what thread I'll need?

I assumed McGill MS would have sold them but there was nothing on their website.




I will ask McGill later this week as I will be going to see them about some parts anyway.


Cool, although I've had a look on their site they don't seem to do male threaded Jackscrews and the only ones I can find online are not metric threads only UNF. Mmmm not sure if I have hit a dead end like Chris had, although I'm thinking of getting some made up. I'm sure this is something that Alex could make.

I've got a spare toe arm on the bench and I'll wait until the track rod arrives then take some measurements for length.
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coullstar
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 13, 2016 3:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rose jointed ends wear quickly do they not?

Fine for limited mileage/smooth track work but on road cars maybe not the best application.
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Chris_in_the_UK
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 13, 2016 3:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

coullstar wrote:
Rose jointed ends wear quickly do they not?

Fine for limited mileage/smooth track work but on road cars maybe not the best application.


If you get decent teflon lined one's they last pretty well - they are fairly cheap to replace TBH.
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Alex
Le Mans
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2000 Porsche 996 Carrera 4

PostPosted: Mon Jun 13, 2016 7:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Just been having a look myself Chris. There may be some 'off the shelf' ones you can get which will obviously be cheaper than me making some custom made ones for you. Not a problem if you need me to though and I should have them turned round and down with you within a few days.

These Moog ones are M14 x 1.5 on either end and I can only presume they are LH & RH as they're an adjuster rod:

http://www.moog-suspension-parts.com/moog-es458s

Might struggle getting them in the UK though.
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Chris_in_the_UK
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 13, 2016 7:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

When I started to try and sort this, one other issue I had was getting a short enough 'turnbuckle' to connect the track rod end to the rose joint McG Motorsport only have a 165mm as their shortest one and I seem to remember that adding this to the rod length and rose joint plus a couple of half nuts was too long. Maybe I didn't look hard enough but it was frustrating to the point I bought the motorsport parts.
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infrasilver
Fast & Furious
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Location: East Midlands

2001 Porsche 996 Targa

PostPosted: Mon Jun 13, 2016 10:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Chris_in_the_UK wrote:
When I started to try and sort this, one other issue I had was getting a short enough 'turnbuckle' to connect the track rod end to the rose joint McG Motorsport only have a 165mm as their shortest one and I seem to remember that adding this to the rod length and rose joint plus a couple of half nuts was too long. Maybe I didn't look hard enough but it was frustrating to the point I bought the motorsport parts.


I'm going to get Alex to machine up the exact size LH/RH rods I need to sit between the track arm and rose joint so in theory it should all work out fine.

What misalignment spacers did you buy from McG to fill the gap, I'm just looking at them online but I'm 140 miles away from the car/garage to be able measure the current bush? The M14 ones say they are 11.1mm wide, were two on each rose joint enough?
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Chris_in_the_UK
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 14, 2016 8:07 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi Chris, I ended up using the 14mm to 12mm reducer in each side of the joint from McGill. The bolt at the chassis end is m12 so it needs a sleeve. This does not leave a huge amount of room so I used 2 m12 stainless washers - one on each side. When it's all tightened up it works a treat.
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Chris_in_the_UK
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 14, 2016 8:14 am    Post subject: Reply with quote


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infrasilver
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2001 Porsche 996 Targa

PostPosted: Tue Jun 14, 2016 11:30 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

For the sleeve, did you just use 14mm OD to 12mm ID tubing?

I'll order all the McGill stuff today. Thumb
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Chris_in_the_UK
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 14, 2016 11:43 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

infrasilver wrote:
For the sleeve, did you just use 14mm OD to 12mm ID tubing?

I'll order all the McGill stuff today. Thumb


I used these:-

http://www.mcgillmotorsport.com/m14-to-m12-rod-end-misalignment-reducers-pair-457/

They also act as a misalignment spacer as well.
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